Post by Ponydragon in Lets talk about a content/age rating system for itch.io

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While that sounds good, would you think there is a difference between a 20yo and a 30yo in terms of recommendation? Because even for 13yo vs 17yo, that concept would not really work out.

And especially for difficulty, there are games that a 13yo will beat, but a 18yo would not. Reflexes and enthusiasm can be very high at that age.

Hmm. The more I think about it, the more that idea becomes ... not bad, but obsolete. Just look at the retro games. People in their 40s and 50s are (still or again) playing stuff that they played as a 10yo. Concerning age, the only important thing is, if you should not play it, because you are too young for that type of conent. The rest is personal interests and that is done via tagging.

(Ok, there are games for pre-school kids, that even young teens would not touch. So recommended age group, is of course a thing.)

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tomiga1 year ago

No I think till 18 will be enough (I know that in some countries 21 is adult age).

Still there is big difference in 13 yo and 17 yo.

To be more precise. As I am author of the game about movie production it is quite obvious with understanding of the film industry between 13 yo and 17.

As I remember myself when I was watching 2001 A Space Odyssey by Kubrick or Blade Runner by Ridley Scott those films was boring when I was around 12... it past many years to understand and appreciate such movies and this comes with life experience and knowledge of medium.

And this is just simple example. What about psychology horrors like Rosmary's Baby by Polanski or classic movies by Hitchcock (13-teens even do not know who he is).

The most statement about my game that is too difficult comes from very young players... because they do not understand some business mechanics, do not have skill of abstract thinking and do not have "life experience".

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Ponydragon1 year ago

2001 is boring as an adult even more. And I watched it in double speed. That one was for people that are high. It had good moments, but overal just too stretched out. You could run it as an art installation somehwere in the background maybe.

So basically you would need a tag that entails that the game is for mature players in a sense that is not usually used in this context. Like the real meaning and not being the fancy word for saying stuff that minors are not allowed to watch.

Btw, I had a look at your gameplay video. Difficulty would not be easier if people were older. Your game is Rockstar Ate My Hamster with movies (wich was played by 12yos) and an interface that reminds more of an office application than of a game. The gaming part is not the problem, kids will figure that out. Sure it is more complex, but you need not know anything about movies or movie production. Gaming (at least one part) is about optimization. You get a budget, a time frame, means to spend money to make money. In short: management simulation game. You make it sound as if you would need real knowledge to play the game. The game should actually teach those mechanics in the context of the game. Teach as in, players will figure out optimal strategies.

(Oh, and I saw Blade Runner as a kid and it was not boring to me. Quite the contrary. Maybe a bit scary. ;-)

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tomiga1 year ago

Yes that is true that game at first sight is playable for everyone. There is nothing fancy there on interface level and it is not a problem to follow some basic mechanics (btw I have written first version of this game when I was 15 years old on Commodore 64).

Still when you play it there are some concepts which is hard to understand for younger persons.

For learning economics it is bit tricky of course it works on long term but now players wants immediately reward, as there is some randomness in the game (based on the principle "Art is not the math") some players have problem with this.
Also problem is to understand the currency in the game are not USD but some abstract currency which is not comparable with anything in the world (especially with salaries or profits real movies which are currently in BoxOffice).
Another concept is abstraction for example limited number of cast "Why I can't hire unlimited number of actors like in Avengers".
Or why you can cast sport star or political in the movie? (it looks that more choices is problem for some players)
game can be taken a bit more seriously or less seriously (and some players have problem with party "why so serious" ;)

About knowing the movie it partially true as it is not mandatory but it gives some additional context and layers of fun (with cult characters concept or cult movies which based on IMDB real films)

So there are small things which requires some abstract thinking and younger audience have problem with it.

So to make it summary yes as you write this is for mature players in not common sense (as most of the ratings based on content) but still I would like to suggest some age category for players. As you do not watch Tarkowsky's or Bergman's movies with 7 yo kid.

P.S. I won't comment your movies preferences as everybody has it's own taste and perception of specific movies :)

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Ponydragon1 year ago

I saw 2001 only a few weeks ago... ;-) High expectations, because the movie was so acclaimed.

The concepts and mechanics are not causing the problems, the way you describe it, imho. Having fantasy currency is the norm in games. Having hidden preferences of your toons is not a problem either, you just have to figure them out. And if the game (accurately) teaches long term economics, yay, tag for educational. Limitations of party size is a staple of any game you control more than one toon. You do not hire a thief to fill a mage's role either. All those concepts are well known and understandable to even young players.

I do not think, I get what you mean with abstract thinking. The whole concept of playing a game is an excercise in abstract thinking. You do see the results of your planning in the game, do you not? I remember distinctly from your video that you even see how the audience reacts and to what. Like having the setting in a specific region. What is "abstract" about making the connection that certain combinations will have certain effects? That is not different from improving your damage per second in an mmo that is played by 12yo.

People will probably not get the assumed easter eggs, if they do not know the movies they recreate. That is a given.

I am not sure, if the kids that now perceive the game as difficult would have a different opinion, if they first encountered the game as a mature adult. My guess the problem is not difficulty, but appeal. Your game looks like an accountant software. Kids dig difficulty in general. Just look at "nintendo hard" or Dark Souls. But just like adults, not all kids dig difficulty. Or management games. But the thing is, more people are playing games nowayday then back in the 80s. Gamer kids back then were more nerdy, and those gamers are adults now. So I presume, that adult gamers are currently a little bit more nerdy than the younger gamers. And your game looks like it appeals to the nerd in all of us. Fussing about details as an accountant.

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