Post by redonihunter in payment issue with card - itch.io

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redonihunter165 days ago(+1)

A debit card is a credit card that immediatly charges the associated bank account.

The card you got from your bank probably is a card that also does this, but it is not the type of card that is meant by debit card. At least not when you read it on an US merchant site.

Can you pay online with the card at all? Or do you need to make a SEPA money transfer? That will withdraw from your bank account, but it is not the same as "paying with your card", even if the number of your card looks suspicously like your bank account number. If your "card" is ok for purchasing in other countries, did they mean outside the EU or inside? ;-)

You are in the EU, you should be able to use paypal and pay paypal directly with your bank, if you have no international cards.

It would be interesting if someone could explain the difference, or rather why debit and credit cards are mentioned separatly. Is it because on a "real" credit card, the payments can be announced and reserved but not actually made?

Rosemary._.1165 days ago

Thank you for answering :)

But I've made plenty of purchases online and they always went really easy :(
And yes, I did check it was for outside the EU and even turned it on specifically for the US... but that doesn't change my card number haha.

I've downloaded paypal as a backup but APPARENTLY I need to wait 3 days for a code and I'm just not that patient...
Thank you though, I really appreciate your answer, but I'm starting to think there's just no way to do it with my card, oh well.

I hope you've got a great day an thanks again for wanting to help!!

redonihunter165 days ago (1 edit)

You downloaded paypal? That makes as much sense as downloading your bank. It is an account, not an app. I am sure they have an app, but you do not need an app, you need an account. After that, when you pay with paypal online, you enter your mail adress and password and paypal charges you by whatever means you told paypal to use. (And as far as I remember, they do check if your payment options work by this strange low level security thing of charging you random amounts and you needing to enter those cent amounts as password. Or something similar. Maybe I misremember.)

The process for "debit cards" is the same as for a credit card. You need the 16 digit number, the code on the back and the expiration date.

Were your previous payments with the card like this? Or did you pay by other means with the associated banking account?

Rosemary._.1164 days ago (1 edit)

:( I don't know how paypal works but to link it to my bank I needed an account and I had to make the account in the app so... I don't know how else I could've done it...

And I've never had problems paying with my card, but maybe that's just because I've only bought things within the EU. I was always able to enter more than 16 numbers for my card info, so I just don't think it's possible with my card on here.

But thank you though :)

redonihunter164 days ago

I don't know how else I could've done it...

... by visiting their web page in your browser, as you did with Itch? ;-)

If you create the account with the app makes no difference. The account is useable by website. And it has to. If you pay with paypal on a shop that has this, they will redirect you to the paypal website. Once the payment is approved by you, after logging in with your credentials, the website redirects back to the shop, but tells the shop that the payment has been taken care of.

The reason this approval works with credit cards is trust. There are things like chargebacks. And for debit cards that can be an issue, if the balance is negative. I think this is why it is a thing to advertise you accept debit cards.

When entering your "card" number, did you only entered the number, or a code on the back side plus expiration date of the card?

Rosemary._.1164 days ago

Oh haha I didn't know. I'll just try it via paypal once I figure it out a bit more haha
Thank you for the help!! <3

And I just entered my card number from the front, or tried to at least, but I have no numbers on the back side...

I just hope it'll work with paypal, thank youuuuu :))

redonihunter164 days ago

If you have no numbers on the back of the card, I wonder how you previously payed online with the card.

Rosemary._.1163 days ago

All my numbers are on the front haha.
There are different kind of cards so I suppose that's why, maybe it also has something to do with what bank you go to and in which country you live...
Also, I tried with paypal like you said but... same problem :( I might just give up, but thanks for the help anyway

redonihunter163 days ago

What the?

Yes, you can give money to paypal via credit card, even if that credit card happens to be a debit card.

But this does not mean you can use your atm card number. Either your card is an internationally valid card or not. My guess is, it is not. If it were you would have a security number on the back. But even if it were a local card, paypal does offer local available payment options.

But you do not need a card. Just tell paypal to collect money from your bank account.

I am still baffled how you paid previously "with your card". What were the security measures? Did you have to enter a password or how did this work? Was it a sepa transaction?

Rosemary._.1162 days ago

I tried it with the paypal app and it finally worked :))
I don't really understand what the problem was either... normally I'd just give my card number and then use one of those cardreader things, Idk if you know what I mean.

ANYWAY, it finally worked :)) thank you for the help haha

hechelion165 days ago (1 edit) (+1)

Credit cards are associated with a line of credit that the user usually pays in a deferred manner. That is, I bought something for 10 dollars, and those 10 dollars are NOT paid at the time of purchase (the bank, not the user, pay to the seller), but rather, they become a "debt" with the bank and the bank then charges you.

Debit cards are usually associated with a bank account that must have the funds to be able to make the purchase, that is, if I buy something for 10 dollars, I must have those 10 dollars in my account at the time of purchase.

All my life, I have only seen 16-digit cards, but searching on the Internet, it seems that they can have more or even fewer digits. I imagine that they are less common banking systems and therefore, more difficult to use in different parts of the world.

redonihunter164 days ago

"debit" cards are a new concept in the US. A country where people are used to sending paper checks per snail mail. "credit" cards were not only the way to pay delayed, but to pay without physically carrying checks or money.

So there is a focus on explaining the difference between delayed and direct payment. But for all intents and purposes in handling for the customer, a debit card and a credit card are the same. It is a card and can be used without the card. Only by using numbers and security informations. Which is misleading. You are not using the card, but the card's account. Using the card is supposed to be a physical thing, but using it online also was called using the card.

To put it in perspective, in the EU you cannot use your normal banking cards online. Not with the information on the card anyways, as legitimization - as you could do with your VISA card. Those cards are true physical cards. They are for atm and paying at terminals in stores. Paying "with the card" online was never an issue, because you could use a money order in several variations. Or later, telling your bank online to send money to the account of the seller. That is cheap inside EU. But sending money to an international account costs like 20 € for the transaction.

But here come the "cards". That it is debit or credit is of little concern for someone in the EU. It needs to be accepted internationally. Typically VISA/Mastercard or even American Express. I doubt that an US based company accepts debit cards from non US banks, even if they claim to "accept debit cards". The important thing is that they do accept debit cards. There is a distinction, because there are things like VISA debit cards. While it is the same for the customer, except for the delayed payment, collecting money from a credit and from a debit card has some differences for the merchant.

Anyways, that is my take on this. Maybe there are errors or misconceptions, so it would be interesting to know what I did get wrong or if it really is this particular.

hechelion164 days ago

I doubt that an US based company accepts debit cards from non US banks

Yes, they do, and I can tell you this from personal experience.

But you've got it nailed down. In order for them to accept it, it's not enough for it to be a debit/credit card, you need it to be "compatible" with their system.

If your bank is from Chile (for example) and they give you a debit/credit card that is, for example, Visa or Maestro, you can use it in the USA if the merchant accepts Visa or Maestro.

If your card is DinersClub, but the merchant's system is not compatible with DinersClub, it doesn't matter if it's a debit or credit(or the country) card, you won't be able to use it there.

redonihunter164 days ago

I used the wrong words. A local card from your local bank is a defacto debit card by nature. One might call it an atm card, but you can buy your groceries with it. And in the EU you can buy your groceries in the whole EU. But it still is a local atm card. Probably not the type of debit card an American thinks about, if you say debit card.

If your card is Visa, it is a Visa card. That it also is in function debit and not credit, is not of any relevance, except for cases where debit visa cards might not get accepted for whatever reasons, maybe higher risk of transactions failing. Visa is not your local bank. Your local bank cooperates with Visa to give you a Visa card.

So I am totally unsure what is meant, if an US based merchant proclaims, that credit and debit cards are accepted. Do they talk about local grocery store atm cards or do they talk about the no delayed payment cards of the major credit card companies?

hechelion164 days ago (2 edits)

Maybe we understand the terms differently. The normal thing I've seen is that the bank gives you a debit card that you can use at that bank's ATMs. In addition to that, the same card is usually associated with another system, such as Visa, Mastercard, Maestro, etc.

If the card doesn't have any associated system, it can't be used to buy anywhere and can only be used at ATMs, and only at that bank's ATMs. It's very rare (I personally don't remember any, but I'm sure they have to exist) to find one that doesn't have any associated banking system. Maybe in the EU it's different, I'll tell you how it works in the countries where I've lived, I'm not saying it works the same all over the world.

My first debit card was from a local bank in my country, in the mid-90s, that is, 30 years ago. In addition to working at my bank's ATMs, the card was associated with the "Maestro" system and I could even use it in the USA, as long as the ATM or store accepted the Maestro system.

The stores I've seen (in several countries), don't tell you if they accept credit or debit cards, but rather they usually have a sign with a bunch of icons for each system they accept.

In recent years, it seems like all the systems are integrated and people tend to refer to them as debit or credit cards or not even that, often simply asking if the store accepts "cards", referring to whether they have one of the machines that allows you to pay with some type of card or if they only accept cash. This is not the correct use of the term, but it is how I have seen people use the term these days.