Post by Mengor in Lustful Desires comments

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To answer your question: I see how people can see in Logan a nice challenge to deal with, a hard nut to crack you know? That sort of thing, then they get to see his other side, that works for them.

In my case however, I dont like when someone yells at me (whatever that reason is). I suppose I can let that detail happen in a fictional world... But I would never be able to endure such thing in a real man: I would lack the courage, guts and patience to withstand any kind of yelling. My 1st reaction would be to run away. Especially for a person that is not very confident.

At my age of 36 I expect (if such thing ever happens lol) that I can communicate and talk things out with my man in a reasonable way. I dont care if you are hot af or what but if you throw sudden violent temper tantrums, that is going to be a big no-no for me lol

Garz02 years ago(+4)

Interestingly enough, Logan agrees with your assessment of him! At least, based on Logan's in-game actions.

He's abrasive, generally doesn't touch people, and with his now ex-wife leaving him he's a very bitter man, who closes himself off from everyone around him.

Every time you help him out, he notes that you shouldn't.. That you should do what everyone does and tolerate him at best. He tries to do everything by himself, often to the point of severely injuring himself rather than asking for help. Logan honestly seems to believe that he should just be alone, since he's not a good enough person to deserve anyone else - the one person he opened himself up to hurt him really badly.

For me, now, my being kind to Logan in return isn't due to a challenge; it's empathy. I'd like to help Logan trust people a bit more again, and you're rewarded for this by him getting less abrasive. Less angry. Heck, it gets to the point where you can have people meet up with Logan who would definitely have caused him to flip out before - but instead now he just grumbles a little, since he trusts you. Is much more willing to stick his neck out. He's still gruff, since he's stubborn, and you're not going to erase who he is (nor should you!), but I find it heartwarming seeing him open up.

The scene where Logan first transforms, you catch up to him, and he in tears begs for you to stay (since he believes you shouldn't and won't) since he's terrified of being alone /right now/ when he's not sure what is happening to him is one of the most powerful in the game to me.

It's then kind of neat, in my opinion, that Hyao has an option for 'Ehhh I just want a ton of sex scenes' instead, haha, as you can always just go for bottom Logan and get plenty of scenes with none of that 'needing to form a relationship with him' in the way. As really, nobody is for everybody - some people find Caleb being a goofball to be annoying, others rather adore him for it.

Either way, that's Logan for you.

xXToothless113Xx2 years ago(+4)

I never thought of it as Logan himself didn't feel he deserved love, but the way you said it actually makes that make a lot of sense! everything he does is to push others away, so he doesn't get hurt himself, but also so he doesn't hurt them. maybe Serena cheating made him feel unworthy of love and also angry at others who get it? like a double-edged sword where he wanted it but couldn't stand the idea and the potential betrayal that could happen after the last time, so in response he shuts himself away and shuts any pathway to his heart, but well, where there's a will there's a way lol.

SrCole2 years ago(+1)

Logan is toxic. Both in game situations and when you bring it to the real world.

He is toxic because he knows how stubborn he is, but he don't do a thing to change it. It just happened because the MC appeared on his life.

And you can say: "But he is hurten and don't know how to call for help or is afraid or it's too prideful to do it" and you're right.

The fact that he is a toxic person does not mean he isn't a human being. He is suffering A LOT through and before game events (since his marriage was basically dead).

On my opinion, what happens to Logan is something similiar that happens in psicology, during a relationship between a psycologist and a pacient. It's very common to the pacient to do something we call "emotional dump" (I don't know the proper word for it in English, sorry) where the pacient start to get feelings for his/her psycologist.

This happens because the psycologist figure is the one that makes you feel better. That understands you. You are not in love with him/her because you like him/her, but simply because it makes you feel better about yourself and you want this person closer to you.

This is basically how I ser LoganXMC relationship. You are the only one trying to help him regardless of how rude he treats you. You are the only one who saw him at his worst and stayed by his side. You are the only one who he feels comfortable to talk to. You make him feel better about himself, you make him feel that he is not a monster (despite he totally acts like one and it's totally understandable why people think what they think about him).

SrCole2 years ago(+1)

You're totally right.

The only reason why we still try to get along with him is because we know this is game. We knoe that sooner or later he will grow feelings for us. But that does not happen always in reality.

Logan has all the characteristics of an abusive partner. He is that crazy ex of a friend of you. Not a nice person, for real.

Garz02 years ago(+1)

While I agree with most of what you stated here, I wouldn't quite say /everything/, since uh...

>We knoe that sooner or later he will grow feelings for us.<

That part isn't true for me at least, haha. Since another person who's pretty abrasive is Gunnar, and I am trying my best to be friendly to him whenever I can even though I honestly don't expect him to grow feelings for me. Like, I'm also a top and do not put up with him being a jerk (particularly to anyone else; this fact is also true to Logan by the by), but I then have consciously stuck my neck out to help him out more than once.

Now, I then don't care about him nearly as much, but my ideal goal for him is 'can meet up on friendly terms' more than anything else haha. Still, I'm definitely being nice to him!

I then only slightly agree with your last statement. It is definitely true that Logan has the /characteristics/ of an abusive partner, but an important line is that he's then /not/ an abusive partner because he imposes on the player exactly once, and that's when you the player go after him during the werewolf event (And is, I believe, the only time he begs for help). If anything, he pushes people away because he doesn't think he'd make a good partner at all, haha, and this is partially because he has serious anger problems, and partially because he was in a relationship and it ended sourly (that relationship also didn't sound the most healthy!)

And remember - the first time you and Logan are really in a relationship is, uh, 'right now'. Before that he realizes he's having feelings for you, and addresses this in the most Logany possible fashion of 'trying to come over and get drunk enough to give you the only thing he presumes you want from him, since he's a mess' (And his dialogue is pretty clear about 'you couldn't possibly /really/ care'). You /really/ are helping the guy out if you go through his route.

If anything, the fact that he goes out of his way to try to /not/ be in a relationship with you helps show that he's a better person than he thinks he is.

Contrast Gunnar for that, haha, which is part of why I'm not at all as interested in him, but can try to be nice to him all the same.

So yeah - Logan is the angry person who lives off by himself and doesn't bother people, which is different from being an abusive person who wants to take advantage of people.

SrCole2 years ago(+2)

I really think Hyao has something planned for Gunnar in the future, since he is not a Jerk all the time. He is very serious when talking about Scar and his mission.

If you're a bottom/sub he'll treat you harsh because that's basically what you are asking for when you met him (It does not help the fact that the MC never complains and the text itself tells you that he's enjoying it). About being a top, I don't know how he treats you, but knowing my husband it probably is not what you expect.

Being a top/bottom does not affect how loving he'll be with you. For know his just there for some (awesome) lewd scenes.

About Logan being an abusive partner or don't. I don't think he is abusive, but he portraits himself as one. We know, from him, that one of the problems from his prior relationship was the lack of sex and then they started discussing more and more. We don't know exactly what happened so we can't state anything from it.

There are a lot of way of being abusive and one of those ways it's how little he opens himself to you. Being in a relationship requires honestly when it comes to feelings and he does not do it at all (at least until where I played, before his new event).

When I played for the first time I thought that was impossible to get a romantic relationship with him because that's the way he acts. Just like the MC, when he starts opening himself up for you, I got confused on what were his intentions: he was kissing me because he liked me or because he thought that was what I wanted?

As I said he may not be an abusive partner, but that's the picture of him we get during the gameplay. He is a mess who's trying to get in a relationship with you and the only fact this is probably going to work it's because this is game. That's not how real life works.

Garz02 years ago(+2)

>About being a top, I don't know how he treats you,
<
I can tell you the answer to this one: He's basically a total jerk to you regardless, haha. He is indeed serious when work is going on, but even then he will stop and drop a jerk statement about what you should be doing, or a jerky-lewd statement about what you should be doing to him.

Now if he didn't then do his job, he'd also be incompetent and Gunnar isn't meant to be incompetent haha, he's a talented guard with some shifty connections. But that is a different story, and he certainly doesn't start a relationship with you and then start treating you harshly because he thinks you might like it (That would be fine).  He opens by treating you very harshly, if you like it then hey that's cool for you.

Then I feel you're not quite being fair to Logan with your statements here!

>There are a lot of way of being abusive and one of those ways it's how little he opens himself to you<

I mean that stands to reason - you're not /in a relationship/ when that is happening! In fact this involves him expressly noting that you /shouldn't/ try to get to know him better.

> He is a mess who's trying to get in a relationship with you<

No, he definitely is /not/ this. He goes out of his way to /not/ get in a relationship with you, to try to stick to himself, to shut the player out, even to the point of injuring himself. The first time he really opens up is when he transforms for the first time and is absolutely terrified about being alone - if you stick with him there you can note him still being hesitant and still being 'why would you /do/ that I'm not a good person'.

He is absolutely not /trying/ to get into a relationship with you, even when he begins to have feelings for you due to your being quite selfless towards him. Heck, the whole focus of the 'I'll get you a beer' scene is that he presumes you don't want a /relationship/ with him and just want to have sex with him due to his muscles, so he's trying to get drunk enough to give you what you're owed without feeling too raw about it.

Him trying to have a proper relationship with you is extremely new to him, and he's /much/ more mellow about it now once he begins actually returning your affection.  Even there he constantly compares himself to the he-thinks-better-fit-for-you Bernard, haha.

If you go after Bernard first, when you tell Logan that you did that Logan is completely understanding, 'Yeah, that was the right move'.

When you go after Logan first, he is astonished, "Wha?! Why didn't you go after Bernard? Why would you go after /me/ first?"

>when he starts opening himself up for you, I got confused on what were his intentions: he was kissing me because he liked me or because he thought that was what I wanted?<

Oh this is pretty clear too - he cannot fathom anyone /wanting/ to be in a relationship with him, haha, but you are extremely nice to him and quite selfless at that point. Really, that's the crux of the 'I owe you a beer' scene - him assuming that the only reason you could be there for him is because you like how he looks.

Which is also a big part of why, if you take that offer and thus confirm his expectations, it hurts him /so much/. And at that point if you refuse, that's the second time he really opens up to you, really makes himself emotionally vulnerable to you.  And also marks a big change in his demeanor towards you, since that's when you actually start 'okay this is sort of a relationship' and he starts being at least a bit more hospitable.

Gunnar is much more of the abusive partner (Gunnar pretty constantly makes demands of you whether you pursue him or not. This is then completely fine if that's your thing, mind you, but is much less fine if it isn't haha). I am happy with the limited 'not tremendously negative' interactions with him that happen sometimes, though!

Logan isn't really searching for a relationship with you (or anyone at the moment, he got burned) and is constantly surprised by your actions towards him, and only starts to really like you when he notes how often you jump in to help him even though (as he often notes) it's stupid to do so since he's not a good person.

...Well, before now haha. If you do have three hearts with him, then /now/ he /is/ trying to be in a relationship with you, and I imagine at least part of it will become pretty rocky since Logan is pretty messed up of an individual. If nothing else, I'm sure he's thinking about his previous relationship every time he does things in this one. So we can see for the future, haha.

I'm glad to have helped Logan get more comfortable with being a werewolf, too.

SrCole2 years ago(+1)

You made some fair point here and there and really change some of my perspective with him.

As I said in other comments I didn't made his new event yet so I don't know how things develop from now on.

I feel bad for all the shitty things he passed through since Selena, but it's unfair how he dump it on the others around him.

Here and there, hopefully the MC will help to heal his traumas and become better.

(About Gunnar, I can't defend myself. He's just so awesome that I can't really criticize [Even though he is probably the toxiciest NPC on the whole game, but I'll turn a blind eye for him])

Garz02 years ago(+1)

I definitely agree haha, Logan definitely is unfair with his reactions to everyone haha.  Like really, whether or not he has a reason for it, Logan is a /jerk/. My one complaint is that I don't feel 'abusive' is accurate... but I mean, jerk is absolutely accurate. :P

Also, you don't have to defend yourself about Gunnar either! Honestly haha, it's totally cool that you like him and are having a blast with him. :D

This game is awesome and is, among other things, a safe place to enjoy yourself, haha.  If you feel strongly about a character, either positively or negatively, that is a good thing!  Means Hyao is a good writer!

I personally was pretty happy when I could at /least/ sit down to play cards with Gunnar and other guards with him acting civil in front of his peers.  Baby steps!

And I wouldn't have it any other way - Gunnar is acting according to his personality for both of us. ^_^

Chibitan2 years ago

We can have 3 Hearts with Logan? I only got him to 2, where did I miss one?

Other than that, this is a pretty good summary of grumpy Logan. Hard shell and soft heart.

itch.io

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