Post by pedrorns in Making a new introduction to my game. Part I: narrative. comments

Making a new introduction to my game. Part I: narrative. » Comments

Viewing post in Making a new introduction to my game. Part I: narrative. comments

Hi there, my King! Be welcomed in our humble democratic polis...

I am planning on some character customization! Nice that you thought that too! I will be frugal on changing the appearance of the character, because our artist is already very busy. She is a student and will only be able to dedicate 240 hours to the project this year.

I am more excited on customizing the character's abilities/story, as you also mentioned. I didn't think about noble/rich versus middle class or poor, but now that you mention it... this is actually a great idea. In book 8 of Plato's Republic, Socrates seems to be talking about an upper middle class citizen, as he (1) can pretend to be from the people but at the same time (2) had enough resources to live a bohemian lifestyle and be educated by a sophist. I therefore can imagine some advantages of being rich: the character can promote more parties to obtain more happiness, and perhaps is able to perform some tasks with his own money instead of been corrupt. However, a rich character may get unhappy when expropriating the rich, because he identifies with them and/or is friends with them. He may also be less popular, and his threat to expropriate, less credible. So, thanks for this idea; it can totally fit the game.

I was thinking about three other customizations:

Gender: male or female. If the player chooses female... the player will lose the game immediately, prompting an ending expressing how sexist greek society was back then. I think that is funny, will require few resources, and will not be seen as sexist on my part. If the character is male, the game continues.
Whether the character is frugal/disciplined or compulsive (may look for better words). According to Socrates, the democratic man is compulsive, desiring not only what is needed but also excesses, in a pursuit of pleasure. The democratic man drinks too much, eats too much, buys too much, parties too much. Focused on his own liberty and a pursuit of mere happiness (but not truth), the democratic man loses control. I expect players to think a frugal character is best, but a frugal/disciplined character won't go to parties or accept bribes, nor will it corrupt the system. Thus, a frugal character won't be able to rise in power or obtain cheap happiness points as easily. The best choice to win the game is to be compulsive. But I may make it possible to win as frugal... not sure.
How unequal the city is: somewhat unequal or extremely unequal. According to Socrates, a populist leader will thrive when there is a lot of inequality, as he can feed off polarization turning the people against the elites and making himself look as a necessary evil. Thus, the best choice here is to go for extremely unequal, although the player will probably think "somewhat unequal" is best. In the game, the strategy of expropriating the rich almost guarantees election when the society is extremely unequal; however, when the society is somewhat unequal, expropriating the rich may not be enough.

What do you think of those choices? Is it bad that I am giving you such spoilers?

Now, with regards to the gods... I can't implement that. Socrates only tangentially mentions god's favor and stuff like that. As this game must base everything on book 8 of Plato's Republic, I cannot incorporate god's punishment.

In Socrates' view, the city did commit a sin: it preferred vices over discipline, the pursuit of happiness instead of truth, pleasure instead of the common good, liberty in place of responsibility. While the introduction will hint at it, it cannot be too clear. The player has to discover for himself that these sins are causing the city's decay, while at the same time riding on these very sins to win the game as a tyrant.

My king, thanks again for your comments, I hope this effusive answer makes it clear how happy this interaction makes me.

Cheers,

Pedro

King 👑1 year ago(+1)

First thank for the fast response (didn't expect an less from a peasant )

Anyway Nice to know you already thought of that and the idea of customizing the city is great but

"The best choice to win the game is to be compulsive. But I may make it possible to win as frugal... not sure." For this I think it's important to allow the players to start the way they want always have a chance to win maybe the gameplay will be different but all of them will have a way to win if not than why do the customization in the first place

I like the idea killing the female I can just imagine the players reaction and no one can call you for it because it's a historical game

Lastly the thing a about the gods is that people in the past don't think of them as mythology but as there realty, what we consider mythology for them it was history take the Trojan war for example it's generally assumed to be a real event but slowly people started to add mythological part , and many other events , citys and cults used to say that they start by same kind of mythological event . So was thinking if you wanted an introduction like AoT and we are talking about ancient Greek why to add same mythology

pedrorns1 year ago (1 edit)

As long as you remain a foreign in these lands, we consider it a privilege to host you, my King :)

I agree they saw gods/myths as reality, particularly up to the 4th century BCE, when traveling around started to shake some beliefs out of them, and some new philosophies proposed a much reduced role for gods or unified them in a single force. But the game is focused on a single book from Plato's Republic. I don't want to add anything else, even if it would be realistic for the time the game is happening, in order not to distract from the main goal.

With regards to the female character... I don't think she would die immediately, she would instead be unable to succeed in politics. Maybe she would become the local oracle I mentioned somewhere else in the game comments.

Let's call her Lysistrata. I am thinking that, if you choose female, you become Lysistrata, a philosopher/diviner, but not a politician, and the game ends in frustration. If you chose a male character, you will encounter Lysistrata as a NPC. Maybe Lysistrata would actually know Socrates' philosophy, and annoy the male main character for being a tyrant in the making.

I do agree with you, there should be many paths towards victory. I do wish I had enough resources to make something really awesome: to create two alternative victory paths, one in which you reinstate the oligarchy (you win but the people lose) and one in which you reinstate the aristocracy (all win, according to Socrates). I am sure that I do not have the resources to do that as of yet, because each path would lead to at least 25% more cost and time, and I don't have those resources. But you are right: all initial conditions of the male character should be able to arrive at a victory, perhaps through a different path and with more effort and luck.

Cheers,

Pedro

itch.io

Viewing post in Making a new introduction to my game. Part I: narrative. comments