itch.io

Ok. Let's take any classic RTS. C&C, Warcraft, Starcraft, Age of Empires, Warhammer 40k, etc. They have, for example, workers. You buy one, he gets some kind of resource. You buy the second one, he gets the same amount. And no matter how much you buy them, their price does not change. The same mechanics apply, for example, to barracks. If you build one, it releases one unit per minute, if you build two, there will be two. If you have built 200 and the units are running like a machine gun.

And now I have a question for you. In these games, everything is exactly as you described. Show me at least a few cases where classic RTS would be called incremental?

And those cases when games with mechanics, as they were called incremental here, were most likely guided by the same misunderstanding of mechanics as you. After all, we have tactical strategies now - and nothing. It's the wildest nonsense in terms of dividing into genres, but who cares?

Update:

And more. The exponential growth of the "currency" is exactly what incremental mechanics is designed to get rid of. Because the constancy of the price of currency producers is precisely what causes the exponential growth of the currency. And since the prices do not change, the game ends almost instantly.

But if prices for currency producers grow exponentially, then the increase in currency is more or less constant, which means the game is progressing smoothly and players do not lose interest in it. 

In fact, what you are talking about is the exact opposite of incremental mechanics. The effect that it was invented to get rid of.

Incremental mechanics implies an increase in the price for each subsequent purchase of the same item/building/unit /upgrade. There is nothing like this in the game, so it is not incremental.

I dropped my race in the Village, which had been going on for a year and a half and the Horde, which lasted nine months. To view the new game modes. Are you outraged by the loss of three weeks? Did the loss of equipment capacity increase cards sadden you, for example? That's me - very much, I'm three orders of magnitude lower in strength. 

An update is an update. New balance, new mechanics, a lot of changes. The loss of three weeks of progress in just one parameter is sad, of course, but not as sad as the loss of a save by people (as they wrote below) or clicking the "buy everything" button in the Gas Giant, spending all the prestige currency accumulated over six months without any warnings. Because of one random click :)

This game is not for weaklings! It is for harsh people who are not afraid of difficulties :)

I have never killed a single click in the entire game. A complete deception!

This is insaniquarium deluxe!

And in my opinion, shapes are the worst element in the game. It's not bad in itself, but it's too different from the rest of the game. See for yourself: now we have nine different games (if the shapes are considered a separate game), and after a year of playing, all these games require 1-2 minutes of attention from me per day. Well, maybe 5-6, considering that the new games have just started and require more player attention. And the shapes at the same time are an active game. And it takes 10-15 minutes to spend all the accumulated motivation. And what happens in the end? Does one game take ten times more time than all the other five combined? A strange decision.

Strange mechanics. Prestige upgrades do not affect the base value, but the strength of the upgrades. Therefore, the first upgrade is always bought for a long time, and then the speed increases significantly. What for?

Very poor balance. I have several Mega Critical upgrades and after buying the first upgrade to Critical Chance, you have a wild chance of a few hundred percent of Critical Chance and Critical Multiplier is several times. In fact, the whole game turns into the purchase of two upgrades. Click Power and Critical Chance.

Strange. Boring.

Another bug. Dragging wheat from the market to the wheat in the inventory does not work. Stacks do not merge, although if you move them first to the inventory, and then drag them from the inventory to another stack, then they merge.

There are too many bugs. The forge works without taking into account the number of input items. The mine requires ten tools, although the maximum stack of tools is five.

It was a long time ago :) But as far as I remember, I had to wait two months to get the right amount of capacity :) Ruby upgrades can help make it faster :)

Gas Giant Mining. The second mining mode.

A great man once said, "Aim higher. You may not hit the target, but you won't shoot your leg off, for sure." Forget about youtubers. Leave the numbers in their pristine nakedness and count on another platform, which is visited by the remaining 90% of Internet visitors :)

That's because your numbers don't give you enough dopamine. They should be fun!  With beautiful animation, colorful coloring, joyful sounds. Even better, if they are slightly dressed numbers with huge breasts. And then seven, or maybe even as many as eight people will download your game.

I finished it in five minutes.

The menu is missing. At least the "Exit" item :)

The window mode is missing. Why do I need this semi-fullscreen mode?

The game blocks the screensaver. Why do I need a monitor that glows brightly all night?

I think once out of curiosity everyone will launch the tower as soon as they get access to it :) I meant not to waste the keys going through 10-20 levels of the tower. After all, the main bonuses in them are every 50th level.

Starting a repair should trigger the purchase of a PC/SC.

As for me, the game didn't load autosave a couple of times. Restarting the game helped once. The other one didn 't help ) Therefore, manual saving is important. No wonder the game constantly reminds you of him. You are not the first person to face a similar problem. And the answer will be the same. Save manually. Just in case.

A little advice. Enter the tower when your maximum achieved zone is at least 30-50 levels higher than the requirements for the first floor of the tower.

Slavery is good! You sit and drink tea while the slaves gather your reeds.

Captain Obvious? In response to "those cards that are not used in this way", you say "not really the same situation"? Well, as a wise man once said: "In life, everything is not as it really is."

This is not an option. Extra cards from decks that improve the capacity of gems immediately turn into gems. These are decks Precious jewelry, Weeked trip, Cold times.

Ok. I will answer in detail.

1) I agree that the excess of something that you got through hard work is annoying. You've been working so hard, and now he's just lying there useless. It's infuriating!

2) "It's going to be good." Alas, this does not work in game development. No one knows if an idea will work or not. Completely incomprehensible things are gaining popularity. If there was a way to predict this in advance, we would only play super popular games :) So you actually said, "I think it's going to be good." And this is the opinion of a single person. No one here supported you. It's just a fact. Without ratings.

3) Personally, I think it would be much better if the game got more content, rather than ending abruptly like a behemoth :) Between a strange unverified idea and a thing that prevents absolutely every player from playing the game, anyone will choose the latter, agree :) But the author has not pampered us with updates for several months now. It's not up to your ideas anymore. To get what you need, we will think about what we want later :)

Update:

I've thought about your idea some more. In order for your proposed mechanics to work, and not just be a strange way to delete cards, you need to constantly buy new useless cards. Do you have any gems for that? Does anyone have one? :) Emeralds, when they appear, can always be spent on treasures. Of course, there comes a point when it becomes pointless to spend them there, but by this point, believe me, you absolutely don't care how many extra cards you have. Check out the discussions below. The Horde, for example, passes under very specific cards. No one cares how many extra cards you get while you're mining these. If one rebirth lasts for six months, you will have more than enough emeralds for it :)

• But they show me.

• And the player also has no choice to spend this resource or not. Why show something that the player cannot influence or use in any way? Ubi nil vales, ibi nil velis.
• And again they write to me where they come from.

• If you don't understand something, it's not necessarily the fault of the one who explained it to you badly.

I said this before, and I will say it now: if a thousand people understood the explanation, but one did not, you do not need to adjust everything to this one. It is much more profitable not to pay attention to him. Or throw it away. Or shoot him. Depending on the situation.

A. I'm sorry. This is the heavy legacy of the Google translator :) The gems were meant. :)

In general, cards are needed to use them during rebirth. And those cards that are not used in this way are immediately automatically exchanged for gems. Where did you manage to find the unnecessary cards? :)

And? You're postulating a thought again, from which nothing follows. Well, I made a mistake with the moment of the appearance of record 34. And what does this change in what I have said? What does this change about what you said? Or maybe we should take the most obvious option? Is this the only time you can object to me? Actually, that's why I avoided dialogue. Your so-called opinion, in which you remain - you can't say anything in support of it, and you don't want to justify it in any way. And you don't give a damn that you offend people with your behavior. Not me-I haven't given a damn about such things for a long time. The developer, for example. That's what he's for? He's a great guy, that's the game he made for us. However, I have already heard explanations on similar situations many times. "I didn't want to offend him, so he has nothing to be offended about." Iron logic, yes.

Meanwhile, the essence is simple. I will say one last thing in simple words. Thousands of players have found obsidian themselves. Dozens could not cope and went to look for an answer on the Internet. And they even found him. But you decided to go further. You decided that the author should adjust the game to suit you. Although, in fact, you've already done it too. But you are sure that the game should not be for those who are able to cope with it. and for those who are not capable. Actually, what else is there to discuss? Go in peace. Wait. "Maybe things will be different later."

I'm just surprised by the logic that people use. You told me a month ago, "Dude, things can change." Firstly, there is a powerful counter-argument "dude, maybe it won't change"! Do you feel the intellectual power of dialogue? But I'm used to thinking well of people until they prove otherwise. Therefore, I assume that your opinion has some basis. And I'm trying to figure out which ones. That is, in your personal understanding, the author made a game in which everything is so long. And then, for some reason, the author will take and redo everything. And, as his fellow programmer, I try to imagine the reasons that would have prompted the author to initially do so in order to redo everything later. The author, in your understanding, likes meaningless work, right? He really likes to do difficult, meaningless work. Without payment. This is probably his favorite part of the process.

Here I imagine how you object to me. "Dude, maybe he'll realize he was wrong. That's so bad. What needs to be done differently." And I immediately imagine the author who made a technically excellent game: non-destructive, without an abundance of bugs, with a convenient interface, etc. But who suddenly did not realize that weeks, months and years are a long time. Well, that's the kind of author we have. Maybe a fragment from an antipersonnel mine is stuck in his head and blocks the sense of time, or maybe he's just an idiot and everything else happened to him by accident. Fools are lucky.

And then I think: but if the author in your understanding is so bruised on the head, why do you think he might change his mind? Well, he's got shrapnel in his head, he doesn't understand these problems of yours! He didn't understand before and he won't understand now. He needs surgery. Doctors' care, a room with soft walls and daily walks in the fresh air.

And it would be nice if you were the only one like that. It's not like that. They complain all the time. That is, annual events are rare for them. Then they lose interest in the game without regular new content. That's something else for a long time. And I begin to explain that the author intended it that way, immediately a wall of misunderstanding.

And, the cherry on the cake. What did you tell me yesterday? That I sound hostile towards the author? Well, it's funny! Your personal position is possible only if the author has problems with his head. And I just have nothing to do with his position. I do not condemn or approve. I'm just playing the game and following the rules he gave us. Well yes. Hostility to the author is coming out of me :) Now let's go back to the very beginning. And also, in response to my description of the mechanics of what is happening, you tried to devalue my conclusions with your "maybe everything will change." You challenge conclusions based on observing the events taking place with your mighty "maybe" based on an insulting opinion about the author. Well, about me, I guess I've done a lot less for you than the author.

Difficult. Even with my principles, it is very difficult to treat a person who thinks and acts like this well.

Now, as for the message under which we correspond. "I feel like there really should be a note hinting about obsidian". Have you read mining note No. 34? The author informs you in plain text that there will be no more notes. And that was long before obsidian appeared. But you still feel it. And what, may I ask, is your feeling based on? Hints are needed for two purposes. Do not let a person forget about something and give a hint how to solve some problem. A reminder is not needed here - the upgrade menu will not let you forget about obsidian. You don't need a hint either - if you've been playing the game for four months and still haven't understood its logic, that's solely your problem. And I told you about all this right away. Just not so head-on, chewing on every detail.

Of course, you can feel whatever you want. But your problem is that the author feels differently. And you still don't pay him. Not for redoing half the game. not for inserting hints for the sorrowful mind. I'm sorry to have to put it like this, but the ancients said "sapienti sat". I followed their precepts at first.

Heh. Well, I'm here because I have friends. One of them decided to read everything that had been said to him over the past couple of months and respond. Here. Now. When 99.9% of the population sleeps after a festive night. After making sure that I regained consciousness. Well, I've regained consciousness, but for some reason I'm not in a good mood :) Out of joy, I decided to see what was happening in the world, and here it is. The Obsidian is gone. It's also an urgent problem. How do I get past here?

> I really like and vibe with what I've seen so far

And yes, I want to answer you in your own words :)

>  I just think that what's currently is there is a very poor indicator to judge by

Just a month ago, you were telling me that I shouldn't judge the game, and that everything is still possible to change dramatically soon. And where? Time goes by and nothing changes not only dramatically, but in any way at all, and you yourself suddenly begin to judge the game somehow. It's not good!

And with all this, you condemned me for predicting the inevitability of increasing the duration of prestige cycles. And now what? Where are all these people? Why doesn't anyone tell me that I'm wrong, and that they still use cycles of 1-2 days? Where are all these wonderful guides on how to quickly complete the game, bypassing the years of gameplay I described? You've lost four months, and still haven't even seen the keys. So where is the confirmation of your position? Only the condemnation of mine. Again.

To be honest, I don't see a problem. Well, judge for yourself: the longer you play, the faster you run through the starting levels. And the moment when you get to the 150th without improving the pickaxe is inevitable. Everything depends only on the player's attentiveness, multiplied by his own laziness. There is nothing to remind you about, Scanning will not let the player forget that he did not find obsidian. There is no need to prompt here - from time to time the player must think for himself. There is nothing to fix here because fixing something that is not broken is a very bad decision. There is, in fact, no subject for discussion here. The only thing is, someone may want to take the easy way and ask for advice from those who have already solved this problem. Actually, I gave you this advice from the very beginning, without really understanding what exactly you want. People constantly want strange things, and when they want it, they also want it on New Year's morning and in a different language...

And yes, I really don't understand something in this world. I'm saying that the author is smart. I'm saying he's prudent. I'm saying that he is able to predict the consequences of his actions. I'm saying he created a great game. I admit that I respect his (and not only his, however) right to self-expression and to have his own opinion. And after all this, it turns out that I sound hostile towards the author? :)

I'm sorry, I don't quite catch the general idea of your statement. Do you agree that this is not the first mysterious resource in the game? That these are the resources that are definitely there, as they are required for upgrades, but the player does not know how to get them - there are more than one in the game. So it makes sense to talk about the systemic nature of the phenomenon. And now I will say again what I am being ignored on this resource over and over again :) And the author knows! He is not an idiot, and he, for example, guessed that three or four years. necessary to complete this game, no one will play it. They'll quit sooner. That one key per week is catastrophically small. That events with a frequency of a year break the players' brains. At least he suspected all this. And he built it into the game anyway. He has some kind of his own vision of the gameplay. And I don't exactly approve of him. I rather hold the position that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Especially the creators. Especially those who are really good at something.

So I'll repeat my thought. I'm a little confused about the purpose of your outrage. I don't believe the author will change this in any way. This is not a mistake, it is an inconvenience, and a pre-punishable inconvenience, which makes it possible to think that this was intended. It's been four months since the release, haven't you figured out exactly what you're playing yet? :)

And it is! :) As well as joy, for example :) You just need to find the obsidian itself first :)

Hmm :) Why is there a timer? I'm currently on a home machine where there is no msdn, so I can lie with the names, but... This is usually done like this: the MouseDown fixes the click point. MouseMove provides data for rendering the drag animation. The MouseUp fixes the exit point of the click. And, in fact, it calls the drag or click handler. If the click point coincides with the exit point, it is a click. If different, there was a drag. Why do you need a timer? If you are afraid that the user will also move the mouse during the click, if he has a tremor or clicks with a finger half the size of the screen on a mobile device, just make a zone inside which dragging is both a click. Just set a condition that the distance between the points is less than the specified (radius of the zone). However, then you will get the opposite effect :) If now I can't click, instead getting drags to a distance of zero, then there will be false positives causing the character to move as a reaction to the micro-displacement of the camera.

There is such a rule, every programmer should know it. "The best is the enemy of the good" :) In another reading, it sounds like "too much is good - it's not good." Unnecessary checks are unnecessary errors. If we're worried about false positives, maybe we should just avoid them? On the computer. for example, it will be enough to separate clicks and dragging the camera to different mouse buttons and the problem will be solved by itself :) It's not for nothing that clever designers have attached several buttons to the mouse at once. It was for a reason! :D

Update: 

And more. Never, you hear, never assume how the user will act. The user is a messenger of Primordial Chaos, dreaming of becoming an Emissary by his actions. Users will always, you hear, always find a way to do something that you would never have thought of. Learn Murphy's laws by heart and hang them in a frame in the most visible place :)

And you think he'll make it in 200 ms. And if not? If he's old like me? If he has arthritis and his fingers don't bend? If he plays at work on an industrial computer with a touchpad and buttons that withstand hammer blows? If he got dislocated/concussion /diarrhea and now he's sitting at home, through cramps and pain, pressing some buttons in some game. And you've already decided everything in advance and for everyone.

I mean, you'll probably decide not to suffer and increase the timeout by another two hundred milliseconds :) Fifteen years ago, that's exactly what I would have done :) And it will even work. It's just that the error will occur even less often and, perhaps, if you overdo it, another one will begin to occur, in the form of a delay when dragging. It is better to get used to doing the right thing right away, so that later you do not listen to the user and do not waste time on alterations. Is not it so? :)

However, it still won't save you from users who want strange things :D

Windows 10. The problem with the mouse is that you have both the click and drag-n-drop tied to one button. Maybe it's convenient for mobile devices, but for me, a click is very often not perceived as a click, but is like a drag and drop. Just a zero distance. I would venture to assume that you distinguish between clicks and drags by timer, but you need to check for the range of dragging. After all, even if the click was very long, but the mouse did not move, this is definitely not dragging. So why artificially limit the player in the speed of movement of his fingers? I'm already old, my fingers don't bend as fast as when I was young :) And therefore, a whole bunch of my clicks are simply not perceived by the game as clicks.

And yes, this is exactly what I told you about :) Unless the dot is not in the lower left corner, but in the bottom center. And it turns out like this:

That is, I am already in the market with my whole body, but the game is still sure that I am at the university.

And, of course, ideally, the buildings' hitbox should be their outline, not the rectangle of the map cells that this building occupies. What if you want to make a lamppost later? Tall, but narrow. Or some kind of rails. I understand that this is an early beta now, there is no need to repeat this again. It's just that often things should be done right right away, no? So as not to redo it later, doing unnecessary work.

I'm not asking you to fix it, and fix it urgently :) My job is to find the bug and tell the developer about it. And let him decide for himself what and how to do with it :) Logic usually has to be connected only to explain why it needs to be done. Developers are different :) I've been talking to one recently. He created an allegedly incremental game. And there are no incremental mechanics in it, which is what I told him. So he told me that I was an idiot and that I misunderstood the meaning of incrementality. When nothing increases anywhere, these are also incremental games :) Let's say warcraft, starcraft and other rts :)

So do what you want and at a pace that is convenient for you. I just explained why this moment looks illogical to me. Although it practically does not affect the gameplay. Just great games usually differ from just good ones in that they pay attention to the little things.

Let me guess: did you think there was mouse movement there? Well... theoretically, it is, yes. If you click the mouse three times, then, as a rule, one of the clicks gives the result. But this is still a hemorrhoid. Because at close distances you just get tired of clicking, and at long distances you click and don't see if he moved there, behind the screen, or you need to click again. It's very inconvenient.

And yes, now do you know what else I remembered? Your hitboxes are weird :) That is, they are not hitboxes at all, but the meaning is the same. When you find out which building the character is standing under, as far as I understand, you take the corner point of his sprite. Most likely the lower left one. And you need to take the center! Because when two buildings stand one above the other, it turns out very strange. The player has already crawled into the upper one, where his heel is only touching the lower one, but the game confidently asserts that he is in the lower building. Again, it is constantly causing inconvenience.