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The dice distribution is obviously a homage to Genesys' dice distribution, with a purposeful evocation of the same design purpose as those dice: The circle / triangle results are  rarer but possibly more meaningful (generally they are closer to "hits"), and then the plus / minus results are more common across the board. However, they mostly mutually exclusive, leading into a situation where if you roll a lot of plusses, you probably didn't roll a lot of circles, and vice versa.

If used in the Genesys model (You roll basically two pools of dice, and subtract the results of one from the other), it's very likely that you will be left with a more complex result than success / failure.

To my own use cases, I feel like dividing the dice into two symbols each has its merits in that it gives a designer the ability to control the symbols a game uses. The distributions themselves are still up in the air, but the current distributions already have a pretty good spread when you break them down.

With the d6, there's a 1/3 chance for a blank (which, by the way, can be used as a result in on itself as well), 1/2 chance of the minor symbol, and 1/3 chance for the major symbol. This maps into a d6 with 5-6 counting as hits, with an extra layer of the second symbol results.

With the d10, there's a 1/10 chance for a blank, 1/2 chance for the major symbol, 6/10 chance for the minor symbol, and 1/10 chance for double major symbol. This is closer to a 50/50 hit die, with a slightly higher chance for the minor symbols, and a "critical" result with the double major symbol.

These both are very close to common dice distributions in dice pool games when you think about it. They just have additional nuances with the secondary symbols.

To me, a flatter distribution with more symbols, like you suggested, has its merits for some designers, but I think the way I have distributed things is perhaps easier for gameplay purposes. I just feel like it increases the complexity of the design space exponentially when more symbols are added per die, as it feels necessary to use all symbols in the dice.

I dunno. The symbols will be open source, so if people want to make their own dice using the symbols with different distributions and symbol combinations, for sure. I just personally don't feel too inspired by the flatter distributions, personally. Sorry.

Genesys dice model
Genesys' dice table

Hi! Lots to think about. Didn't mean to be on the attack, just was trying to be really clear on where my brain was at for this and why it wasn't jiving for me yet. I can also see how the qualms I had about the breadth of application aren't your priority, and therfore not an issue.


Initially the biggest thing I like is your point about how the mutual exclusivity plays out in dice pools, especially (but also without) the subtracted dice pool. The other aspects require more thought on how they could be applied. I'll take a look at how Genesys uses the two types of symbols for an example.


Totally different thought- idk how much experience you have doing digital art. If you want help with stylized models of your dice, I'd be happy to come up with something and open source the result.

Oh, don't worry about it, no offense taken. I just got caught up in explaining the system so I didn't really take into account how I came off. Sorry if the response was a little blunt on that front.

But yeah, having a cursory understanding of how Genesys' Narrative Dice work will help in the thought process I have behind this endeavor, though the dice are a little different in that Genesys actually has 6 symbols and 6 different dice, not 4 like I do for both. The two additional symbols and dice are not without their merits, but I feel like they work better within the confines of Genesys itself. But then again, this will all be open source, so who is to say people wouldn't make additional polyhedrals in the long run using the symbols?

So Genesys is a slightly different beast despite being the origin. Though, I personally feel like ultimately the best mechanics that people can come up with on these dice will be much more interactive and imaginative than the basic Genesys-style subtraction.

For the digital art side... I will admit I am not an artist. I am going to expand my skillset to the realm of 3d modeling at some point, and I do some light graphic design, since I do the layout of my books by myself. What do you have in mind? Something akin to alternative stylizations or ornaments for the dice? I would definitely appreciate that.

Having alternative versions of the dice (simple, stylized, ornamental etc) would definitely help legitimize the designs a lot.

I'm pretty good at the 3d software, but I don't have an extensive art background to reference. Ie., I'm flying by the seat of my pants. Here are some stops along my pants flight:

  • I'm great at digital modeling but I've never made physical dice myself. I do have a 3d printer to make the initial model, but taking it the next step (making a silicon mold and resin casting) I would leave to someone else.
  • Currently your dice have sharp edges. Some people like that. We could also easily round them.
  • Hollow dice, like a cage made of some squiggly or zig zaggy pattern are doable, model-wise. Good for digital tabletop but hard to manufacture.
  • We could also explore stylized versions of your symbols. Probably plus and minus should stay mostly the same, but there's a lot you can do to a triangle and a circle and still be recognizable.
  • I'd use Blender for modeling, shading, and exporting the dice and Inkscape for the symbols.

I also like teaching, so if you want to play around yourself, I'm happy to point you toward a usable workflow. Tbh that's my preferred path, because it takes less work for me and I'd feel like I contributed what I wanted to this project.
 

Yeah, for sure, if you would prefer to just give pointers, I'm not gonna refuse any help I can get! I'm going to slowburn this project anyway, I just started higher education (again) and I have a moderately-sized Backerkit campaign starting in... 3 days (No Panik at all!). So I'm kinda strapped for time right now, but I will probably have much more time on my hands during the spring and summer.

I just put this thread and project on the wire pretty early because I think it really benefits from the longer timespans in the planning phases.

Honestly, all the ideas you have are very cool (doing a digital 3d roller app + maybe some VTT plugins would be cool and a good way to get the dice out there). I personally use Affinity currently, but good thinking with the Inkscape and Blender angle. I'm familiar with both, but not very proficient with either.

oh Affinity is great just not free. If you've got it go for it 😄

Ping me if you ever want to chat though, good luck w your semester.

(1 edit)

Nah I just meant that while Affinity is great, for an open source project it's best to use open source software. That way you can easily share the core files in a way that are editable to anyone.

... Unless .svg actually does that for vector things, in that case I wouldn't really need to learn inkscape again.

ETA Anyway, I'll get in touch whenever I actually need the help (and I'm pretty sure I will).