You do it whenever you see Momoko's reflection in the mirror.
3 years ago (+1)
Definitely not clear in the game. Also, if you use up all the hiding spots, do the enemies stop spawning or is there a hiding spot with infinite usage?
I mean that's literally a puzzle for the player to figure out, lol.
Enemies can only spawn once in the same location. There's less spawn locations than there are hiding spot usages, so it's impossible to use them all up.
Edit:
I looked at your stream, you never looked at the reflections, you ran like madman through all of them and got attacked repeatedly.
3 years ago(+1)
I did sort of look after, but looks like you have to look before they spawn, not after.
It isn't really clear that it is supposed to be a puzzle and initially, I didn't run like a madman, I walked through like I would normally.
Same. I couldn't figure it out. Not very intuitive. I tried looking at the reflections a few times but nothing happened so obviously I was doing something wrong. I ended up buying multiple health items, running through them, dying a few times. (Sometimes they walk over the mirror's hitbox, not sure if that's a glitch). One time I got lucky and managed to escape. If you try and go back they're still there. Reminded me of Pocket Mirror's mirror maze, which despite how frustrating it was, you had an idea of where to go and do for the most part. I'm just glad it wasn't a huge map.
I agree with you about the chase scenes and the layering issues. Although I do like the different monster designs, that horse was creepy. Also a really nice tile set. I played a similar game a while back that used similar graphics tiles, I have a screenshot if you're interested (I don't think it was ever finished). Also that broken giraffe sprite in the main park though, poor thing. :(
I'm not really sure what you're proposing I could even do to address this issue, that I should be having Asuka go "Huh, my reflection sure looks weird, I suppose I should look at my reflection more" or something in that line? That would be really weird and tacky and completely ruin the thing. I really don't know how else to present something like that other than completely break the immersion of the player or put a tutorial box, which would eliminate the whole point of the room in the first place.
Honestly I feel that part of horror games, especially retro horror games like Clocktower is trying to figure out what to do and what's the sollution to the problem, even when they're vague. This is meant to be a retro horror game and emulates that unknowing factor of what you can do.
3 years ago(+1)
The problem is when your puzzle defies the rest of the game up to that point with no real clues. The rest of the game basically suggests you to keep moving and avoid the enemies. Then the mirror wants you to stop. These are two conflicting ideas.
What can you do? Many things. As an example, a book in the shelf of books that mentions a story about the face in the mirror.
Day XX YY
Today, I thought I saw a shadow in the corner of my eye. I turned and, for a moment, I thought I saw the face of a stranger looking back at me. I must have been imagining things since as soon as I faced the mirror, I could only see myself reflected.
You could've also had, for example, a room with a doll facing a mirror and blood leaking from the mirror. This would be subtle, but might be something that the player might remember.
Another way would've been to create a natural way to see it happen. Have it start with a path leading right, then make a turn up with a mirror two spaces up. Have it so that the enemy shows up in that mirror, then when the player turns up, the enemy disappears and your reflection shows up.
There are many ways to do it without breaking immersion.
From what I recall of clocktower, it provided plenty of clues to the player. They were less vague and more subtle. Vague and subtle are two different things.
That story doesn't really work because the mirror image being Momoko is related to the plot as you know, since you beat the game.
The turn idea works lot better, I may actually explore something like that in future version after the contest but I need to change the layout of the mirror maze. Thank you from the suggestion!
Actually, Clocktower didn't provide any clues aside the mural and the breakable wall being different color, if you didn't know what you were doing you'd go in blind and not be able to get S rank, because some objects you didn't even know would be important would get lost in the background like the photo which you can't even see that it's on the desk in the graphic. Also, no one who plays that first time has any idea that pair of hands come and strangle you through a mirror in that game either and there's no clue about that or the killer parrot that can kill you if you don't grab the sheets.
3 years ago (+1)
That specific story might not entirely work as-is, but that was an example. You could address it as a fairy tale or urban legend or as a similar account. Someone else seeing something similar doesn't necessarily have to directly relate. It could be two separate issues with a common solution. The other person could have just been seeing things while you could actually have it be something.
For example, with my story example, the other person could've actually been seeing someone actually there, but who moved out of sight when they turned, perhaps hinting at a secret passageway or such.
There are definitely more ways to do it, I just gave a few suggestions/ideas.
Another option would be to assume that the players are going to fail the 'puzzle' and brute force it. For this, you would want to try to balance the items so that the player would really have to try to fail. Make it so that all the items are viable purchases, not just the chocolate bar.
Also, I managed to hardlock myself in a different way. Wasted all my money on health recovery food and not sanity recovering food. Went into the mirror hall, saw Momoko turned around, saved, and exited. Now I can't get past because all my saves are impossible to beat. That actually would have been an interesting solution if you could escape the room and have the Momokos despawn and stay despawned, but all the Momokos respawn on re-entry.
I also want to mention that sometimes clues come in forms that you might not expect.
Like Demon Souls and Bloodborne, the enemy and boss room designs were also clues on how to beat the enemies and what attacks the enemies would use. If you paid attention, just looking at the boss areas pre-boss could tell you how to fight some bosses.
I mentioned the ghost thing with having the clues being part of gameplay.
It can also be leading the eye. This is done by making it so that your eye naturally rests on a certain point, by using very specific patterns in the texture, etc.
It can also be training. Slowly teaching the player to do a certain set of actions. This does mean avoiding doing the opposite of this training though.
There is also association. For example, you find a bow and arrow and see a target, you automatically think: bow and arrow == shoot target. If you show a moving red line of light that seems to be looking around, then on finding the player, starts to follow them. Many players that have played certain stealth games or movies will assume laser/sniper and look for cover. The important thing to note with this is that it only works if you can reasonably expect the playerbase to all have the associations. If you show a laser line in a game to a group of people who have never heard of a laser or laser sight before, it just becomes a moving red line.
Related to association, even something like a name can be a clue. For example of a vague one, Autumn. You find yourself at a cliff. Now, another way to say Autumn is Fall. A more concrete example would be Ariadne. You see a spiderweb on a door and you have the name Ariadne. Ariadne gave a thread, spiders spin threads. As can be seen, the problem is that name clues are usually weak clues. (That doesn't have to be the case, but it relies heavily on associations). This can be made stronger by attaching those names to something more concrete, such as calling a boss 'Achilles' and giving it a weak point of the heel.
That said, there are games, especially older games, that don't do a good job at providing the clues, but there is really no reason to copy the bad parts of older games. If we wanted to do that, we'd get rid of saves and have the player find codes that they can input to start the game at specific points, use horrible camera angles to make the game harder, ignore accessibility and make the game hard for colorblind and deaf players to play, have horrible controls that people just get used to after several iterations, etc.
Why do you not have enough sanity to kill that one Momoko? I have no idea how you're playing this game but you're clearly doing something very wrong to be able to lock yourself out of the game like that in such a specific, weird way that no normal player would ever play it like that for it to even become an issue. Besides, you get free soda from one of the trashcans, so even if you somehow can't afford to buy items and you have run out of all sanity, and made it so that Momoko is blocking your way, you should be able to recover enough to defeat a single Momoko there and then just solve the mirror room puzzle like you would normally. If you still fail even after all that, that's on you at that point, lol.
The problem is that on my way out, I ended up with multiple Momokos. And I was kind of trying to see if you could actually hardlock yourself with some effort. It is very much possible if during chases, you attack a lot more than you should. Also, the fact that Momokos respawn when you re-enter (if you don't kill them) doesn't help.
As you can see here, the Momoko is facing the other way and she never turns around. This makes this Momoko unkillable because you can't kill her from behind. This means that this Momoko prevents you from progressing.
You can only kill Momoko if she is facing you or you might need a certain amount of stamina/hp, she doesn't turn around, and she doesn't seem to otherwise respawn.
(And as for another bug... that mirror image....)