itch.io

Well this is a fun comment section. 

I'm not going to get too much into the AI discussion since I feel like my feelings on that are too complicated to address in the scope of an itch.io comment (which knowing me is probably already going to be way too long). What I will say is that you clearly put in a great deal of effort into making the models and animations for this, and while you're absolutely going to continue getting some pushback, I don't think you should stop making this or stop posting it or whatever. There seems to be a clear difference here in the use of AI in this game and just slapping a quick prompt together and generating a generic anime waifu.

While we're on the subject though, some of the visuals can be a bit rough and there are some errors. A couple that I noticed, for example:

- when Sam is sitting on the bed and his ear twitches, it looks like his face is kinda... collapsing?

- So fun. But there are a lot of useful comments as well. I did put a lot of work into it. It will not be perfect, there's no way around that. Sam has sometimes done things that frightened me, and I will ask him to behave for future chapters. His face needs to stay intact, I very much agree.

- when Sam is walking after leaving the house, one of his feet is plantigrade and the other is digitigrade. In other shots, sometimes both are plantigrade and sometimes both are digitigrade.

- Fuel for the AI haters, I'm sure. This is a very common AI problem right now. I'm left with either reducing the animations a lot, sticking only to the very few that work well, or spending a lot of money (spoiler, I don't have a lot of money).

It's not for lack of prompting, both in Stable diffusion, and in the animation process. The process is pretty much this:

- Generate the wanted image through prompting in Stable diffusion. Typically with a ratio of 1/10 or 1/20, meaning 1 out of 10 or 20 is a useful picture. 

- Import to Photoshop to correct errors, cut it out and place it on a green screen background. 

- Animate it with KlingAI, which again often does not succeed. 

- Import it into Premiere Pro for chroma/color keying, and add a transparency layer to it, tweaking the loop. 

- Import to Visual Basic script and give it a name etc, ready for the game.

It takes time. That's completely fine, I think it mostly works.

While Naho had some really bad takes, I actually do agree with him to an extent on the animations. Having animations for Sam for much of the game is fine, but he does not need to be moving at all times. For example, you can have him be static during the meal scenes where he wouldn't be doing a ton of movement. In seated, static scenes like this, the constant movements can get a bit distracting.

I also think you should be more selective in moving the "camera" for the backgrounds/scenes. I found this very unnerving when first entering the house, but the more you use it, that effect quickly wears off. Where I think it works is as a kind of subversion of expectations for what a VN looks like. Players are typically used to static backgrounds, so having the background shift to move like a first person horror game can quickly increase the tension by taking the viewer out of their "comfort zone", so to speak. So maybe use that for particularly intense scenes rather than just like, looking at a forest.

It simply happens, the AI won't listen to me, so I've had to work around it. In my opinion, if the background perspective is shifting, the characters should follow, which they don't - it would be an insane amount of work and I might break the engine.

Again, I could use static backgrounds, that's just not what I wanted. The very first scene in Chapter 2 (not released) has a static background with parts of it lightly animated. I may do this more, I may not.

As several others have noticed, there were lots of spelling, punctuation, and grammar errors, but it seems like you're already working on addressing that.

There is also some really stilted sentence structure going on here, and that may be a translation issue.

Ex. 1: .....

......"The fox had been lonely."

(shortened quote to save space)

- Yes I'm working on the writing, fixing the many mistakes, as well as changing things that are not realistic, or not good enough.

I'm going to look closer at your examples. I will work on it, but you should probably still expect some things to be a little weird going forward. It won't be perfect - hopefully, the world as a whole will be appealing.

Is there something that predisposes MC to follow the fox from the bus station? Is he lonely? Is he depressed? Is he looking for adventure or excitement? Is he a horny gay furry? If the idea is for it to be totally mystical, A) maybe consider having it not be since grounding decisions in character is almost always more satisfying than having them happen solely for the plot; and B) convey some of that with Sam's responses. Have him be aloof, evasive, cagey, but friendly with at least a hint of charisma. Things that make MC suspicious but intrigued.

Also definitely convey VERY early on that MC is a human and that anthros are not normally present in his world. I did not realize either of these until the house and that really changes how that intro should play out. You should clarify this both for the benefit of the reader and because MC should react SOMEHOW to seeing a real world anthro for the first time.

- This is definitely one of the weaker parts of the story. As I wrote in another reply, some of it is intentional. I'm trying to keep the framing of the MC and their motivations, to a minimum, so as to suit any reader. In this, I may have missed the mark, and ended up making him one-dimensional.

Of course, you would expect a reaction from the MC when he meets an actual humanoid fox, and I can understand the disappointment when there is none, or when it is not properly explored. I had reasons, but yes.

Look, at the end of the day, I think you should stick with it. I know I can be a little heavy with the red pen sometimes but the point isn't to attack you or discourage you. If I thought this game was a trash heap I wouldn't have spent the better part of an hour writing a whole-ass dissertation on my feelings about it and how to improve it. Regardless of the (hopefully interpreted as constructive as intended) criticisms that I have provided, I do legitimately want to see where this story goes and how this world develops. Best of luck to you, truly :)

- I understand how it might feel unnatural. I have made several mistakes here. For one, as I described in a reply below, having the MC be without much character to them, to avoid assigning personality traits to the reader they do not feel at home in.

We met Sam for the first time on the bus station and had with him about 3 or 4 four sentences from each side.

And then we decided to go on a walk with the strange mysterious fox for 3-4 hours.

IN ALMOST ABSOLUTE SILENCE

We haven't even learned his name to this moment.

- Yeah I know. It's 'cute' but not realistic, and probably grating on the reader. I was thinking the reader might fill in the blanks and was also playing with the scenario that the MC is in shock, or not completely lucid.

Music:

It's good!

Especially the last track, cause it plays in the right mood and time.

The only thing I would advise is to choose tracks more accurate for moments.

Music in the house got me overwhelmed with all this noise in several minutes...

- That's fair, I know Harpsichord isn't for everyone. I'm practising a "less is more" approach with the music for some of the newer tracks I've been making. It's tough, but this is a VN, the music should support the narrative, not steal the focus. I get it. We'll see if I succeed. The track in the house in Chapter 1 is meant for a different place (in Chapter 3).

GUI:

Sorry, but it's just bad.

It's almost base GUI but with ultra-small fonts and strange scale.

- Yeah, I'm working on it. It should have been fixed before the first release, especially the tiny text and tiny menu buttons.

Artwork?:

I'll be short and clear.

I do not appreciate this kind of stuff in any games.

It looks creepy and glitchy and has an uncanny valley effect so I dislike it, this surely will not work out for mass audience.

The only moment that I enjoyed of it's the transition of the house from autumn to winter, it was kinda cool!

That's the most of that I wanted to tell, English isn't my native so sorry for any possible misunderstood.

- That's fair. You should have seen all the stuff I've thrown away. There will be more morphing things, and things will get stranger. There will be some weirdness. I am practically playing on it for some things. At this stage, it's impossible to make it 'perfect'. 

I don't think any of the things I make will ever appeal to a mass audience. I appreciate you taking the time to check it out and give me all this valuable feedback.

Wish you luck with the project!

Thank you!

I think you need to smooth out the edges of this project. Make the demo of this game a little better, fix the mistakes, and then write a couple chapters of the story. After that, publish a new demo.

- This is what I am doing atm. I am learning as I go, and trying to be as humble about the process as possible.

Regarding the story. I would advise you to write a backstory of the characters, at least the backstory of the MC at the beginning. Where he's from, who he is, where he's going, etc. At least briefly. Because right now it looks like two strangers met and went somewhere for unknown reasons, -Why? - Just because...

Let's say the protagonist can share his live story with Fox as they walk down the road. The fox might say something brief about himself in return. 

From my point of view it is important that at least something about the main character is known at the beginning of the game, otherwise it feels like a gap.

- I understand this critique. It's very valid. It may seem strange, but it was actually a conscious choice. Sure, some of the dialogue simply isn't realistic enough, and I will work on that. I was working under the assumption that the MC should fit the reader, and since I don't know the reader, I cannot assume too much about them. In doing so, I swung into another cul-de-sac - having a MC who is bland and one-dimensional.

You can write this VN, you did well for a start, don't give up)

- It may be a while before the next chapter, and rework of what's already here, but I'm working on things, thank you :)

I was not expecting it to be good.

It was a very interesting atmosphere to it. I usually don't like linear stories that have no or minimal choices, but I really liked this (oops, only now just noticed choices won't be implemented until later chapters. I'm excited for those!).

- Interesting. I'm glad it didn't disappoint. Yes, we'll see about that :)

I'm not a fan of AI art, I was really iffy about checking this story out because of it. However, after reading, I feel with the setting of the world, you are using it to tell a story that can only best be told if using AI artwork.

- I'm waking up to this - the fact that people are more averse to AI than I initially thought. I'm pleased you can see what I can see here - that this story is in a symbiotic relationship with AI, rather than hindered by it.

- This is what I hope people will appreciate. The music, and the feelings I'm trying to create. The emotional world-building. Music is the art form I'm most at home in. If I can make someone else feel something similar to what I feel, that is my highest aspiration. Thank you :)

There are a lot of typos though. Grammar and spelling.  At least there was in the first part, where the protagonist meets Sam in his world and walks with him. Once they reached the cabin, I stopped noticing it because I was too interested in the atmosphere and setting.

It IS weird though, that you have no idea what an isekai is though LOL.

Isekai is a fantasy subgenre where a character is transported (or reincarnated) into a fantasy world. The protagonist of Interloper walks down a road and enters a different reality. This, by its briefest definition, makes it an isekai.

- I have always just sort of done my own thing.

This is an oversight of mine, as I have not educated myself about this concept. I've always been uninterested in trends, or in being defined by subcultures. I never really felt I fit in any of the boxes. In this case it sounds like I'm literally writing something a bit like an Isekai, while being ignorant about the concept. The thing is, I don't think it will harm the story. I am unbound by the tropes or typical story motifs, since I don't know about them. Will I be making some banal mistakes that could have been avoided if I had taken a more informed approach? Yeah probably. But I think - I hope - I'll also bring something else to the table.

Honestly, I think the story was formatted well, the "suspension of disbelief" you mentioned, I could easily understand what was going on and felt it was done very well.

- I used to write when I was a child. I enjoyed it quite a bit. I haven't written in over a decade, so it's fun to do it again. I'm glad you felt it was worth your time :)

I can't say exactly when the next chapter will be, and I will probably take a bit more time with things. Thank you for your kind words, they are much appreciated.

I'm not into those excessive muscles either :D I think it's fair if that's what the author wants to see, but I admit it also puts me off those stories. The scale - are we talking in the prologue (before they start walking together), I can certainly see that. It has been a challenge doing this with AI. Probably a lot more difficult than people think it is.

I'm currently making corrections to the writing. There are a lot of mistakes... typos spelling mistakes, grammar. I'm also considering rewriting the prologue, but this is a maybe. If I do, I will be correcting those scale issues that are present there.

Maybe a less realistic visual style of AI model would look better, but maybe not.

- It's a difficult problem. Some of these issues will be quirks that would require an amount of technical work detrimental to the process, as most of my time would be spent trying to sew together body parts in Photoshop. And honestly, if I chose that route, I'm not sure I even can.

The music is nice, just in the theme of the atmosphere of the game.

I'm glad you liked it :)

I don't understand the hatred towards AI. It's the same imaging tool as a painter's brush, and just like a brush, AI needs to be mastered to create good art or animation.

I wish you good luck in creating this VN, and will wait for new updates. Btw, what kinds of anthropomorphic animal characters will be in the game? Some cute lynxes won't appear in it by any chance?)))

- I can't say, but lynxes are very cute, I agree :) I appreciate your kind words a lot. Since releasing this, I have had a bit of a culture shock. Even to the extent that I have been undecided about whether to even continue the project here. In that case, I would just make it privately.

So I appreciate it.

I would just say that it would be my hope that people can see the potential for weird worlds previously impossible, instead of focusing on what problems AI create. I can only try to share my vision.. people usually don't understand what I have in my head before things are more complete.

I would say I'm making a visual novel because I'm fascinated with AI and where it can go, rather than that I want to write a visual novel, and just happened to settle on AI for the visuals. ..So commissioning art is not very relevant in this case. Even if there are some amazingly talented people out there, it would be impossible to create the animations. If I were to commission art and then animate with AI, I would still need 100's of pictures.

I have some scary stuff planned, and some very strange things already made. If people like this story, I will gladly publish another chapter. I'm a little put down right now, tbh. I'm doing this project to escape some struggles in life that are not minor.. so I guess I can't deal with too much negativity.

The inteface and Ui also do not help. Everything seems smaller then in other vns for no good reason, and character sprite is haunting me somewhere from the right side at all times. It all really distracting and get in a way of experience.

And it doesn't sound like the moving character thing is for you. That is fine.

First of all, animations in this game are overused. ANimating character sprite both in and out of CGs as well as locations as if you are recording  on camera in real time feel completely unnecessery and distracting.

Animations in the beginning of the story are lacking atm. I made them as I went along, writing the story. I then went back and changed some things, but I see there are some.. 'bugs' I would almost say. Where the same annoying animation is looping badly, again and again. Things like these will be better in future releases.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'both'. It's either CG, or sprites (which is also CG, but yeah). The CG is occasional, the sprites are primary.

The CG in the first scene is primitive compared to what you'll see later. I'm using KlingAI, and it.. evolved while I was making the first chapter.

It takes a lot of work and money to animate this, because there are so many 'flukes' - not being able to completely control what you get. I've spent $150 on compute so far, I think. Not that that is important, I chose this and I am excited about the possibilities.

The landscape scenes are supposed to be with a static camera angle, but that very rarely succeeds, to as an example. I work with what I get.

When fox thing lead protagonist to a house, protagonist goes on the balcony by himself and states he was living here for a long time?...

No that's a misunderstanding, but I can see how that may need to be rephrased. What he's saying, is that he's lived in the general area where the beginning of the story takes place, and he believes to still be in that area - which is not the case.

"The point of furry isekai's (or at least the descibtion of the game makes me believe that this is na isekai) Is to transpor a protagonist from the world familiar to us to a world that doesn't." I'm not sure what you're talking about, I don't know what isekai means. Maybe I should, but - If it's a story format, I'd just say you've got it wrong. I'm not following any style or format, other than my own, I'm not trying to emulate anything.

Yet here in original world seems like anthro people are commonplace, so that's automatically makes this world unfamiliar to us. And then we get transported to another which... is also unfamiliar to us...

Yeah, the whole thing is just a mess.

Please understand, that this is not a finished story - this is just the first chapter - and even that, is not finished. Honestly I find your critique unreasonably harsh, and I suspect it might be a language issue for you as well. I want to listen to fair criticism, but I don't understand your hostility.

Appreciate it!