Don't mind supporting devs where it is due, but as someone on a fixed income due to a chronic disability 5-10 dollars is actually a lot to spend on something that isn't neccesary.
Devs that lock their content behind a paywall really irk me. Either make it pay to play, or do a delayed release for non patreon members, but making it impossible to obtain the rest of the story without paying is a low and dirty move.
I may be wrong, i may just not see it somewhere, so correct me if I am wrong, but that is exactly what is seems like is going on here.
Again, I have NO problem supporting devs, as I have in the past, when the game is good enough, but again.. A paywall to finish the damn story? That'll never get my buck.
Viewing post in City of Broken Dreamers comments
I agree, but some can argue against that by posing the argument that the dev's gotta make a living somehow.
Anyways, yes $10's a lot for a VN but there's not much we can do about it, the dev's are gonna loose popularity with this anyways and have to delay release etc to keep their fanbase and cashflow at a steady pace, so in reality its futile for both ends.
It's a poor argument. All you have to do is look around and see how many VN's are abandoned/unfinished. It's a plague. Donations for unfinished works, only incentivates devs to abandon their work and start a new one.
The racional is simple: If 90% of the people who are interested and willing to pay for the full game, already did pay for 50% of the work, why should I bother to do the other 50%?
Might as well start a new one from scratch, with just enough to entice people to once again dish out their money, and keep on rince and repeat going forward.
No donations for unfinished works. That's my policy.
That rationale is absolutely braindead.
There are two problems I see with that.
1) Premise is often extremely important in getting people to take an interest if your work. There's a number of authors who had one great premise and none of the rest of their works really compare - even later ones. J.K. Rowling is a good example of that.
If you've got a decent premise, you'd have to be a fool to give up on it. Who knows how good your next one will be?
2) You're going to get a reputation for unfinished works.
Besides, what do you mean "already did pay"? Patreon supporters donate on a monthly basis, or with every release. Sure, there are some people who subscribe, download all the works, and then unsubscribe, but you would still get their money again when you finish the product, if not every few releases. Devs are not incentivised to stop working on the game halfway through.
Besides, PhillyGames already have a finished game under their belt. If that isn't proof of their commitment to their products, I don't know what is.
The main reason there are so many unfinished games is probably the same reason there are so many unfinished fanfics. That shit is hard. It takes commitment. People lose interest in their work.
It's not because they're scamming people, they just don't have what it takes to stick with their project and see it through to the end.
No.. what is strange is that is all you decided to take from my comment. I have no issue paying to support a dev when the game is A: A well written story. B: Is at least 50 percent finished. (Other's made the same points I was thinking, albeit a lot more eloquently than I could have.) C: Just because I am permanently disabled on a fixed income shouldn't automatically mean I shouldn't have access to the same things others do, yes I am aware the VN's aren't "important" but as someone with a hell of a lot of free time on their hands, I enjoy reading them all the same. My fixed income should not be a barrier to have access to something as simple as an indy VN.
And I wouldn't have even Downloaded the game in the first place if it stated that there was a pay wall to finish the story.. i just dropped it on me. That's where my issue is. Hence why I stated either make it pay to play entirely or not at all. I don't feel "entitled" to play vn's however I think a little transparency before I waste my time and get invested in a story only to be told I have to pay money to finish is a shady move.
Ah, I see what you mean.
Maybe this was a later addition but it is clearly stated now, at least, that chapters 5 and 6 are on Patreon (near the top of the page).
With that said, I'm not entirely sure what you mean by C. Why shouldn't not being able to afford something mean you can't access it? As someone who is also on fixed income due to a chronic disability, I sympathise with your plight, but unfortunately life isn't fair.
now your argument went screwy.
" Just because I am permanently disabled on a fixed income shouldn't automatically mean I shouldn't have access to the same things others do"
this aint the USSR. if you want full-socialism, try north korea.
and you DO HAVE ACCESS. you just choose to spend your money elsewhere.
also, your disability is not my disability. life aint fair. deal with it.
Demo versions are free. Playtesting is a paid for service.
Finished products are saleable products, and investors have rights to the content.
Subscribing to incomplete products is a fucking joke, that's not how game-dev works. these types are scammers, there is no logical debating point about it. the industry sets the standards, not individual devs. if you fell for the bad business practises of a scammer, that doesnt make scamming right, regardless of whether you have suffered the consequences yet or not.
The fact is many people paid for the product up front and in good faith here on Itch.io, expecting to eventually own the full product, in accordance with the "early access" model.
now if you want to own the game, you have to pay again, and worse - fund left-wing terrorism and social lynch mobs by funding the political vigilante fundraising site, patreon. fuck that shit
What the fuck are you talking about?
1. We weren't talking about the subscription model. The person I was responding to played the demo, which is indeed free, and were upset that the rest of the game is locked behind a paywall.
2. If anyone is allowing people to pay up front on Itch.io for an incomplete product and expecting them to pay again every time the game is updated, I agree that is predatory and unethical. That doesn't seem to be what's happening with City of Broken Dreamers, though. You can't pay for the game on Itch.io, you can just download the FREE demo. Coincidentally, the game is up on Steam, and last time I checked, updates are free.
3. If you are suggesting that the subscription model itself is unethical, though, then we have a real disagreement.
It's not a scam if they're literally telling you what you're going to get. I'd be very surprised if anyone using Patreon or a similar website thought they'd get all the benefits with a one-time purchase, whether or not we're talking about a game in early access.
Buying erotic fiction is not a right, it's a privilege. Your situation sucks, but as erotic fiction is not necessary it is something that you could simply not buy. If you don't want to pay for the game, this is the way to go. There is nothing "low" about putting four whole chapters out for free and then locking the rest behind a purchase, that's just something you made up to guilt trip developers.
Besides, if you feel that you HAVE to buy this piece of erotic fiction, don't eat meat for a week and you will have saved that money right up.
*Copied from another reply of mine for ease*
I wouldn't have even Downloaded the game in the first place if it stated that there was a pay wall to finish the story.. i just dropped it on me. That's where my issue is. Hence why I stated either make it pay to play entirely or not at all. I don't feel "entitled" to play vn's however I think a little transparency before I waste my time and get invested in a story only to be told I have to pay money to finish is a shady move.
add to that the fact that they are charging a high premium for an [Abandoned] VN
you sound a lot like a gatekeeper at this point and I refuse to continue this debate any longer.
Huh? First of all, it says Chapter 1-4 under the download button and just under that it says that there are more chapters on patreon. How is this not transparent enough for you? Where do you want the information to be? It is at the top of the page already!
Second, the game isn't abandoned, what are you even on about? Chapter 10 released in august, 3 months after chapter 9, and chapter 9 released in april, 6 months after chapter 8. Releases are slow and right now we still have 10 days before the release is "late", which is absolutely fine. If you want bad shit, look at someone like I don't subscribe to the patreon, so I don't know what the latest dev updates are, but there was one at the start of November.
$5 for the latest version one week after release isn't a high premium. It isn't even a premium. It is a low standard for something of this quality.