Post by We'rein1984 in [#CommunismIsEvil] - How about you work in the fields.

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Viewing post in [#CommunismIsEvil] - How about you work in the fields.

We'rein19841 year ago(-8)

I do actually have examples of this idea you guys are pushing to dismantle the current system and replace it with something else whatever magical new system you've come up with. Take a look through just this wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutions_of_1989. If you want to say dont trust wikis how about these aswell just so I can be sure.

What you need to show me is that Capitalism sends society into chaos and fire. From what I've seen your type are the only people burning down citys in the name of a drug addict.

GuiWong1 year ago(+5)(-1)

You send lots of links, I'd love to read them all but since it looks like you didn't even read what I'm saying and just continue ranting about your ideologies, I guess I shouldn't take the time.

I could end by saying something something like " your type can't even understand basic ideas out of their comfort zone ",
but i don't believe that and i hope we may be able to communicate. Read my comments again, nothing to do with communism.

We'rein19841 year ago(-8)

I did but you seemingly cannot understand that this whole thing has been done before and always end the same. I know what you think, you think we can create another system besides capitalism and communism. Well then firstly tell me what that system is. Next realize that this same exact thing has been tried and tried and only leads to communism because when dismantling a system it universally always creates a power vacuum in which a dictator takes place. How entitled do you have to be to think that capitalism is this big evil while your living in all its riches. You can spend time arguing with a random dude online on technology which would be unthinkable even a hundred years ago.

GuiWong1 year ago(+6)(-1)

"Well then firstly tell me what that system is." I joined this jam to think, explore ideas, and communicate on that subject. I personally don't know "what that system is", but i believe such a system exists.

"Next realize that this same exact thing has been tried and tried and only leads to communism"
I don't know if you know, but Communism is a political system, while capitalism is an economic system. Both can happen at once, and destroying capitalism doesn't mean destroying our politic system (Sure, it'll changes a lot of things). I don't have any links to send to you right now, but I may do some research if you're interested.

"when dismantling a system it universally always creates a power vacuum in which a dictator takes place"
Sadly this happens often, yes. But it doesn't mean that's an universal rules.

"How entitled do you have to be to think that capitalism is this big evil while your living in all its riches."
uhh, Climate Change? Ecosystem destruction? I may see a world without bees because toxic pesticide are overused and big companies use their money to influence laws. In France, neonicotinoids should have been forbidden since 2018, but the big sugar producers managed to get a special derogation until 2020, then until 2023.
Maybe you think the world should work like that, and riches company should have their word to say in the laws, i don't. A world were the riches can change the law to get richer is far from a true democracy.

"You can spend time arguing with a random dude online on technology which would be unthinkable even a hundred years ago"

yeah, technology, not capitalism. It seems to me you confuse lots of concepts with capitalism.
We live in a capitalist world since a lot of time, so much time that lots of people can't even consider/imagine the world without it.
That's the point of this jam. Thinking, Imagining, sharing. Exploring possibilities deemed impossible by some people.

We'rein19841 year ago(-5)

1 If the system does not exist is it really a good idea to try to dismantle the current system.

2https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/communism.asp#:~:text=Communism%20is%20a%20political%20and,is%20nonexistent%20or%20severely%20curtailed. Its both a economic and political system most system are. Also do you really think you can remove our economic system a quiet frankly laughable dumb idea without causing the political system to fall aswell. For example what if most people don't want to idiotically destroy one of the best systems ever created. Better send them to the gulags for not agreeing with the regimes plans ay.

3 Give me 1 example where this has not happened. It happens atleast 95% of the time so is this really a good idea. Even if we both agree that pollution is the fault of capitalism even though it comes mostly from the Ccp a communist country. Still explain to me why this is a better alternative destroying the lives for millions over earth. Which isnt even true if you want to actually study statistics sure there is increasing carbon dioxide. But this does not correlate to a linear increase it about caps out at 3 - 4 degrees increase. Which I dont know why you are so insistent that all this is the fault of capitalism when capitalist country's produce the least and fight it the most. You wont get rid of pollution of any kind by dismantling a great system.

4 I dont disagree I think toxic chemicals that harm environment should be banned that has nothing to do with economic or political systems. It simply does not there is no correlation.

5 The rise of technology can directly be connected to capitalism because massive technological leaps for example the first commercially wide spread cpu was created because of competition between 2 companies for capital.

6 Atleast come up with an idea because your like everyone in this jam you think capitalism is this big evil and someone else must have a better solution when that simply is not the case. Everyone can argue for what your arguing for and seem like someone who only cares about the environment and the poor . I do too and use to think the same until realizing and learning that this is a very unoriginal thought and has been tried hundreds if not thousands of times and only causes more suffering. If you truly care about the environment how about focus on helping it instead of destroying a system which is the only way it can recover. If you destroy capitalism today the world wont be fixed you will only destroy its defenders. There's this great quote dont know who it belongs to but it goes like this "The poor do not care about the environment" when you destroy this system it will only cause hard working people to become poor no one will care about the environment. How about creating rewards for company's for helping the environment. This is actually doable and as in game design instead of punishing the user rewarding them more for doing something right.

GuiWong1 year ago(+3)(-1)

I see you at least took time to read my comment this time, even if most things I said weren't understood.
I'll go more in depth about your point 4.
The law that forbid the use of neonicotinoid has been voted in Europe (starting in 2018 i think).
The ONLY derogation is for the big sugar producer.
They managed to get until 2020 to "adapt"
then they managed to extends this to 2023.
The production is for export, the need for Neonicotinoids comes from the "need to make profit"

Capitalism allow rich industry like that to influence democracy.
You may not see the link between capitalism and environmental destruction, if that's the case I guess we just have a too different vision of the world to be able to communicate.
It's my turn to ask you to give me an example:
I say 95% of the time, a capitalist system is always putting profit above environmental issues. Do you have an example where it's not the case?

We'rein19841 year ago(+1)(-5)

Its pretty obvious the system which you associate with killing the planet is the biggest combatant against its destruction. The us for example is 5% of the the carbon emissions. While the U,S government has put collective hundreds of billions against it. Now how are the other countries doing on this. Well the Ccp has done nothing about climate change while being one of the biggest emitters of it. Also the Climate has been changing for years and there's little to no evidence that supports the claims that climate change is destroying the environment. Deforestation is totally but guess what that's not happening in the U.S its happening to extremely poor countries who are willing to sell their forests for money. Because like ive been saying the poor do not care about the environment. If you want stop this maybe start with the poor. Watch this episode of Peterson's podcast its with Bjorn Lomborg who runs one of the biggest environmental research groups. Completely self funded and is very much on the side of the environment and their lab cant find one ounce of proof of environmental destruction. Its not on the companies to fight climate change its on the government to put in policies which do. If you truly want to fight against these issues how about you take a shot and run for congress, or anything else maybe even go outside of your comfy home and pick up trash that would be start. Also no one is denying that companies putting profit over the environment is good. I would say burn Nestle to the ground if I could. However its on you to show me that communist systems would handle climate change better than capitalist systems do. However there arent examples of this being the case, because these systems dont care about the environment. The communists and poor are some of the biggest polluters. Im not blaming the poor either because its not their fault. However the communists its very well their damn fault.

AFrogThatExist1 year ago

It is true that in the last 10 years china has realeased the most greenhouse gases, but the US has contributed more to climate change in its histrory compared to China. It all depends on what timeframe you are looking at. =]

The Chromian1 year ago(+3)(-1)

ah yes, communism is when dictator

you're on a completely different page than everyone else

We'rein19841 year ago(-5)

Im saying that it either leads to communism or dictatorships. Did you even bother to read the post.

GuiWong1 year ago(+5)

You ask us if we ever read you, but you're the one not reading anything anyone says. All you do is keep ranting about how Communism is bad. Despite lots of other subjects, you always come back to Communism. I think you are a very close-minded person. There are subjects we could agree on (burn Nestle), but you can't talk about anything without being aggressive, and you bring EVERYTHING to communism.

You seem unable to communicate without bringing everything to your vision of the world.
Are you that scared of anti-capitalists militancy?
I can understand your point of view, even if I disagree. You clearly can't and it looks like you're talking alone, saying the exact same thing over and over again.

itch.io

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