I'll begin by saying that controls are weird and uncommon for this genre of games. I played plenty of 2d bike games from Free Rider and Happy Wheels to Elastomania and Gravity Defied. And usually right and left keys are used to lean forward/back and to drive forward and brake you use up and down. Alt, Ctrl and Space are also uncomfortable and I'd prefer something like ZXC. Although, since it appears that mobile phones are your primary platform, your controls scheme would be more suitable.
Zooming out when you're going fast would also be nice, cause sometimes you don't know what to expect, especially when you're falling down.
Other than that it's a fine game, don't have much else to say about it.
Not sure if these issues were a bug or not (I had a gamepad connected and played with it):
It felt really weird how you have to mash buttons to move instead if just holding them.
Please make attacking up or down only require you to hold the direction and press the attack button instead of pressing them at the same time.
Overall, if feels like the game isn't registering me holding buttons properly.
That made it feel unplayable to me. However, the idea of a classic motorcycle game with a puzzle spin seems like a good one (if you can make it better than Happy Wheels), and there's lots of polish in the art (even if it needs some better consistency), and I appreciate it.
Since I used up my phrase (with parenthesis) quota, I'll leave by saying this seems like a game with good potential, but some glaring issues that nonetheless seem easy to fix. Hope to see the next version in DD39!
Thanks for playing! Sorry you ran into issues, yes I think they were bugs. I've noticed bugs with my gamepads digital pad (but not analog pad) where i need to continually press a button for it to register. This is not the intended behavior, holding buttons should register. I will look into it, sorry about that :/
Thanks for the other feedback, yeah I agree I could use more consistent art style. I'm hoping to do major rework to address these issues and unlock this games potential, your feedback is really appreciated. Cheers :)
Wow, thank you for this indepth video!! You had a lot of great points that I wrote down in my notes and will be addressing in future releases, so thank you so much. You were spot on about weak points in many cases.
I'll try to make the controls more configurable for mouse input. I am a normie gamer who normally uses a controller instead of mouse/keyboard so I didn't think of that lol
haha this was great, played through it all, good job
some thoughts:
There is something really funny with the entire concept, its a mix of the music and the graphics. you could obviously polish it more but keeping a crude (i mean it in the best way) southparkish look is only serving the game well.
sometimes when flipping or looping the bear would stop after, i think its because you are locking the directional input, needs some tweaking to feel right
Im getting some Elastomania vibes, i was hoping you would play into that a little. player requiring spinning or balancing to get past obstacles
some high level design thoughts: i think/feel you are trying to do two things and sometimes they are clashing. one part feels like you are going into the speed and movement part of the game but then theres a second part where you are making a puzzle platformer. mixing them up is not a bad idea but i dont think your levels are taking advantage of either niche. Maybe try to do a few smaller levels playing around with the powerups or just being movement based.
I dont think springs and buttons should require an input
Maybe also play around with giving you upgrades permanently, they you could build several levels around e.g. the bounce spring and then add on other powerups to that.
Played through the whole game on Linux, no issues. Nothing to say that others haven't said yet, but here goes:
There are too many keys that don't really serve a gameplay purpose. Attacks could be removed entirely, and although I get that you wanted to leave it up to the player whether or not to interact with objects, right now there's no reason to not use them. Perhaps if the levels were more puzzle-like or there was another reason to take a slower path, then it would make sense, but right now it's just a timing check whether the player presses the button at the right moment.
The maximum speed doesn't feel satisfying right now, you reach it pretty much instantly but it's still slow. You could increase the limit but slow down the acceleration to let the players actually build up speed.
You should probably add a small delay between object activations, I could mash the interact key to hit a spring twice which resulted in a higher jump than usual.
I really don't like having to let go of a direction and pressing it again to start turning in the air after a jump. You could add a small delay when becoming airborne, after which the bike starts rotating like usual even if you keep holding down the key instead.
Besides all this nitpicking it was a really nice game though. Now you just need a lot more levels.
I went as far as Suburbia 1, stopped when I got to the puzzly parts. I see you got a lot of feedback already so I might be repeating some stuff but here we go anyway:
Recovery time after crashing is a bit too long, breaks the pace a bit
I would prefer if the ATV kept rotating if I keep holding the button after jumping off a ramp, rather than having to let go of the button and press again
I stopped at the puzzly parts for a reason, I'm not a fan of having to press buttons to open doors and backtrack in what is clearly supposed to be a speed platformer
I felt like the maximum speed never really "got there" if you know what I mean. It feels like a cozy stroll even after hitting the speed object. Though this could be partly due to lack of juice as well - definitely could use some particles when going fast
Objects should be used automatically rather than with Ctrl, I think it would let you design levels better as well. You might want to keep it manual to give the player a choice, but your level design doesn't do that - if I fail to press Ctrl on time and don't get boosted and as a result and I'm forced on a different path with less food, that's fine, but right now if I miss the button press I just have to go to the left a bit and redo it because there is no other path
I think at maximum speed I should smash through deer and birds rather than getting slowed down by them
Overall it's a fun concept and could be shaped into something great, but I think the level design holds it back for now
Thanks so much for this feedback, I really appreciate it. You hit on some really good points that I agree with, I struggle a lot with level design. Yes having speed boosts and the spring activate automatically would be more intuitive, but then the player can't make any choices in the game. I think I will start with restructure the levels just like how you said ("if I fail to press Ctrl on time and don't get boosted and as a result and I'm forced on a different path with less food, that's fine"). This should make failures less punishing while allowing users to make choices.
I agree with your other points, I'm gonna allow smashing through birds and deers, bump up the speed. Seriously thank you, this was some A+ feedback.
Was fun! Got to current end of game. Mechanics were clear and all seemed to work smoothly. Arts good, I especially like the backgrounds.
Im kind of confused what the difference between the strength/health bar are. Does strength have an effect beyond changing health? Having to press a key to pick up items, activate the speed boosts, and eat all kind of feel like busy work that could be done automatically. With that said, there where moments where speeding along and timing the right keys and the right time had a nice rhythm to it so it really depends what your going for.
The time till you fall through a platform when pressing down seems long. Unless there is some other use for pressing the down button I didnt catch, could you not just make it so you fall through the platform the moment you press the down key?
Thank you!! The strength bar basically acts as a buffer to the health bar. I wanted a mechanic to force players to seek out food quickly, and decrementing the health bar directly was seen as too stressful (ie a "tightening noose around the neck"). I think I'm going to rethink the whole food system based off of other comments.
I'm struggling with the interaction system. Yes having speed boosts and the spring activate automatically would be more intuitive, but then the player can't make any choices in the game. I think I might remove all interactions for food/attacks/foraging and just focus on that "nice rhythm" of interacting with speed boosts and springs with the movement.
Yes I will decrease the time for falling through platforms, thanks for that feedback I agree completely.
only complaint is that the music doesnt feel like it fits, it sounds too calm for something so crazy
btw there was a lot of jitter on the player character, this is likely cause of godot's physics process thingy agains my 144 refresh rate monitor, i know it cause i had this same issue in my game (i solved mine by just moving everything to regular process but my game isnt physics dependent so it might not be a good solution for u)
Thanks! For the music, the first level is very calm/orchestral on purpose. The next level music gets a bit more chaotic, and as levels progress and the bear finds themself in more crazy situations, the music will build until it is very crazy. But I do agree with you to an extent.
Thanks for testing on a 144 hz monitor!! Yes the jitter is something I'm aware of, I need to implement fixed timestep interpolation better so different draw rates work well. I appreciate the feedback.
I haven't seen you post in a while. The premise is still great and you've done a really good job with the movement.
It would be nice if the ATV landed on something it would just kill it. I assume enemy death animations will eventually be added as well.
Also is there any reason as to why items don't just get automatically picked up. I feel like the key could be it's own thing. If the reason is that you want control over the pickup is to remove the ability to accidently replace an item you don't want, i feel like this is something that is better solved with level design rather than system design. The easier this game is to play the better, i'm a bear on an ATV i don't want to think too hard.
Thanks for the feedback, really appreciate each of your points.
I can make some items get automatically picked up, I agree that having smart level design can make it work. And striving towards simplicity is another goal as well.
Other stage items like the speed boost/spring/button etc. need to be manually "inspectable" so a user makes a choice to use it or not.
Why can't I change the resolution? Seems weird with how big it is. The down key doesn't work as well for doing through certain platforms. Other than that, you are good. But I really enjoyed the gameplay. It's like sonic and an older android game combined into one. Music and graphics are really good. Keep at it, but I would recommend slowing down the pace of introducing new mechanics, it gets overwhelming for new players and they need time to learn and to experiment with what is given to them.
I do think you have a really great base and you can make a really great game with it. I'll probably buy it when it releases desu.
I will make the resolution configurable next release, thanks for that. And thanks for the feedback! I will try to make it simpler and introduce new mechanics more slowly. Appreciate it.
Before I comment, I have to point out that I am not a fan of Sonic at all. Never liked them, and this clearly takes influence from Sonic. Now that that's out of the way, here's my feedback:
- I think there are too many systems. The initial impression of a bear on an ATV is great. Funny, catchy, interesting. But it's making a certain promise: a big fierce bear on a trucking ATV rampaging through the forest. But now I start playing, and I have all these weird systems. Eating, calories, platforms, hitting control on metal things, and so on. Come on! I'm a bear on a fucking ATV! It's too fiddly.
- The actual movement on the atv feels good.
- It is simply insulting that a bear on an ATV get hurt by running into deer and birds and crap. Come on!!!! I'm a fucking bear on an ATV!!! I should be TRYING to run into every bird, deer, and whatever I can. I would remove the "space to attack" altogether, and just make him automatically attack anything he touches. That sounds way more fun.
- It has the same problem as sonic. It promises that you "gotta go fast" then punishes you horribly for going fast. There is so much fiddly stuff everywhere causing me to crash and get hurt, then I have to stop and eat berries from a bush. Focus on the core experience here, and make sure everything is supporting it. Because right now it feels like everything is working against it.
- The speed feels too binary. I'm either stopped or puttering along. Consider having an initial quick phase of acceleration, followed by a long tail. That gives you an incentive to keep moving and building up speed, not stopping every 5 seconds.
- I don't think the system where you have to press ctrl to interact with the "boost" things and the "springs" is good. Why don't they just automatically activate every time I touch them? Right now it's just punishing and lame every time I miss one.
To sum up, I think you have a fundamentally fun system of controlling the bear on the ATV. But there are so many other systems built up around that that conflict with it. Don't try and make the game into something it's not, make it the best version of what it actually is. Really hope my feedback isn't too harsh, I just see a path to a good game, and want you to take it. Good luck.
Thanks so much for the feedback. You aren't too harsh, each of your bullet points are valid and are exactly what I need to hear. "Don't try and make the game into something it's not, make it the best version of what it actually is." is true, I should try to follow the fun and focus on what works. Thanks again, seriously.
Comments
I'll begin by saying that controls are weird and uncommon for this genre of games. I played plenty of 2d bike games from Free Rider and Happy Wheels to Elastomania and Gravity Defied. And usually right and left keys are used to lean forward/back and to drive forward and brake you use up and down. Alt, Ctrl and Space are also uncomfortable and I'd prefer something like ZXC. Although, since it appears that mobile phones are your primary platform, your controls scheme would be more suitable.
Zooming out when you're going fast would also be nice, cause sometimes you don't know what to expect, especially when you're falling down.
Other than that it's a fine game, don't have much else to say about it.
Not sure if these issues were a bug or not (I had a gamepad connected and played with it):
That made it feel unplayable to me. However, the idea of a classic motorcycle game with a puzzle spin seems like a good one (if you can make it better than Happy Wheels), and there's lots of polish in the art (even if it needs some better consistency), and I appreciate it.
Since I used up my phrase (with parenthesis) quota, I'll leave by saying this seems like a game with good potential, but some glaring issues that nonetheless seem easy to fix. Hope to see the next version in DD39!
Thanks for playing! Sorry you ran into issues, yes I think they were bugs. I've noticed bugs with my gamepads digital pad (but not analog pad) where i need to continually press a button for it to register. This is not the intended behavior, holding buttons should register. I will look into it, sorry about that :/
Thanks for the other feedback, yeah I agree I could use more consistent art style. I'm hoping to do major rework to address these issues and unlock this games potential, your feedback is really appreciated. Cheers :)
Wow, thank you for this indepth video!! You had a lot of great points that I wrote down in my notes and will be addressing in future releases, so thank you so much. You were spot on about weak points in many cases.
I'll try to make the controls more configurable for mouse input. I am a normie gamer who normally uses a controller instead of mouse/keyboard so I didn't think of that lol
Was gamepad an option? I would have tried it if I knew!
Yes gamepad is an option! Xinput / XBox360 / Whatever Godot supports should work :)
I had a lot of fun playing this, the game has that old school flash charm to it.
Thank you!! I grew up playing old school flash games, so I appreciate it :)
haha this was great, played through it all, good job
some thoughts:
Good job!
Played through the whole game on Linux, no issues. Nothing to say that others haven't said yet, but here goes:
There are too many keys that don't really serve a gameplay purpose. Attacks could be removed entirely, and although I get that you wanted to leave it up to the player whether or not to interact with objects, right now there's no reason to not use them. Perhaps if the levels were more puzzle-like or there was another reason to take a slower path, then it would make sense, but right now it's just a timing check whether the player presses the button at the right moment.
The maximum speed doesn't feel satisfying right now, you reach it pretty much instantly but it's still slow. You could increase the limit but slow down the acceleration to let the players actually build up speed.
You should probably add a small delay between object activations, I could mash the interact key to hit a spring twice which resulted in a higher jump than usual.
I really don't like having to let go of a direction and pressing it again to start turning in the air after a jump. You could add a small delay when becoming airborne, after which the bike starts rotating like usual even if you keep holding down the key instead.
Besides all this nitpicking it was a really nice game though. Now you just need a lot more levels.
i like it! but i feel the music needs to be changed to rock or metal because nothing can be more metal than a fckn bear on ATV.
I went as far as Suburbia 1, stopped when I got to the puzzly parts. I see you got a lot of feedback already so I might be repeating some stuff but here we go anyway:
Overall it's a fun concept and could be shaped into something great, but I think the level design holds it back for now
Thanks so much for this feedback, I really appreciate it. You hit on some really good points that I agree with, I struggle a lot with level design. Yes having speed boosts and the spring activate automatically would be more intuitive, but then the player can't make any choices in the game. I think I will start with restructure the levels just like how you said ("if I fail to press Ctrl on time and don't get boosted and as a result and I'm forced on a different path with less food, that's fine"). This should make failures less punishing while allowing users to make choices.
I agree with your other points, I'm gonna allow smashing through birds and deers, bump up the speed. Seriously thank you, this was some A+ feedback.
Was fun! Got to current end of game. Mechanics were clear and all seemed to work smoothly. Arts good, I especially like the backgrounds.
Im kind of confused what the difference between the strength/health bar are. Does strength have an effect beyond changing health? Having to press a key to pick up items, activate the speed boosts, and eat all kind of feel like busy work that could be done automatically. With that said, there where moments where speeding along and timing the right keys and the right time had a nice rhythm to it so it really depends what your going for.
The time till you fall through a platform when pressing down seems long. Unless there is some other use for pressing the down button I didnt catch, could you not just make it so you fall through the platform the moment you press the down key?
Played on linux, ran into no glitches.
Thanks for the demo!
Thank you!! The strength bar basically acts as a buffer to the health bar. I wanted a mechanic to force players to seek out food quickly, and decrementing the health bar directly was seen as too stressful (ie a "tightening noose around the neck"). I think I'm going to rethink the whole food system based off of other comments.
I'm struggling with the interaction system. Yes having speed boosts and the spring activate automatically would be more intuitive, but then the player can't make any choices in the game. I think I might remove all interactions for food/attacks/foraging and just focus on that "nice rhythm" of interacting with speed boosts and springs with the movement.
Yes I will decrease the time for falling through platforms, thanks for that feedback I agree completely.
its pretty fun i dig it
only complaint is that the music doesnt feel like it fits, it sounds too calm for something so crazy
btw there was a lot of jitter on the player character, this is likely cause of godot's physics process thingy agains my 144 refresh rate monitor, i know it cause i had this same issue in my game (i solved mine by just moving everything to regular process but my game isnt physics dependent so it might not be a good solution for u)
Thanks! For the music, the first level is very calm/orchestral on purpose. The next level music gets a bit more chaotic, and as levels progress and the bear finds themself in more crazy situations, the music will build until it is very crazy. But I do agree with you to an extent.
Thanks for testing on a 144 hz monitor!! Yes the jitter is something I'm aware of, I need to implement fixed timestep interpolation better so different draw rates work well. I appreciate the feedback.
I haven't seen you post in a while. The premise is still great and you've done a really good job with the movement.
It would be nice if the ATV landed on something it would just kill it. I assume enemy death animations will eventually be added as well.
Also is there any reason as to why items don't just get automatically picked up. I feel like the key could be it's own thing. If the reason is that you want control over the pickup is to remove the ability to accidently replace an item you don't want, i feel like this is something that is better solved with level design rather than system design. The easier this game is to play the better, i'm a bear on an ATV i don't want to think too hard.
Thanks for the feedback, really appreciate each of your points.
I can make some items get automatically picked up, I agree that having smart level design can make it work. And striving towards simplicity is another goal as well.
Other stage items like the speed boost/spring/button etc. need to be manually "inspectable" so a user makes a choice to use it or not.
Why can't I change the resolution? Seems weird with how big it is. The down key doesn't work as well for doing through certain platforms. Other than that, you are good. But I really enjoyed the gameplay. It's like sonic and an older android game combined into one. Music and graphics are really good. Keep at it, but I would recommend slowing down the pace of introducing new mechanics, it gets overwhelming for new players and they need time to learn and to experiment with what is given to them.
I do think you have a really great base and you can make a really great game with it. I'll probably buy it when it releases desu.
I will make the resolution configurable next release, thanks for that. And thanks for the feedback! I will try to make it simpler and introduce new mechanics more slowly. Appreciate it.
Before I comment, I have to point out that I am not a fan of Sonic at all. Never liked them, and this clearly takes influence from Sonic. Now that that's out of the way, here's my feedback:
- I think there are too many systems. The initial impression of a bear on an ATV is great. Funny, catchy, interesting. But it's making a certain promise: a big fierce bear on a trucking ATV rampaging through the forest. But now I start playing, and I have all these weird systems. Eating, calories, platforms, hitting control on metal things, and so on. Come on! I'm a bear on a fucking ATV! It's too fiddly.
- The actual movement on the atv feels good.
- It is simply insulting that a bear on an ATV get hurt by running into deer and birds and crap. Come on!!!! I'm a fucking bear on an ATV!!! I should be TRYING to run into every bird, deer, and whatever I can. I would remove the "space to attack" altogether, and just make him automatically attack anything he touches. That sounds way more fun.
- It has the same problem as sonic. It promises that you "gotta go fast" then punishes you horribly for going fast. There is so much fiddly stuff everywhere causing me to crash and get hurt, then I have to stop and eat berries from a bush. Focus on the core experience here, and make sure everything is supporting it. Because right now it feels like everything is working against it.
- The speed feels too binary. I'm either stopped or puttering along. Consider having an initial quick phase of acceleration, followed by a long tail. That gives you an incentive to keep moving and building up speed, not stopping every 5 seconds.
- I don't think the system where you have to press ctrl to interact with the "boost" things and the "springs" is good. Why don't they just automatically activate every time I touch them? Right now it's just punishing and lame every time I miss one.
To sum up, I think you have a fundamentally fun system of controlling the bear on the ATV. But there are so many other systems built up around that that conflict with it. Don't try and make the game into something it's not, make it the best version of what it actually is. Really hope my feedback isn't too harsh, I just see a path to a good game, and want you to take it. Good luck.
Thanks so much for the feedback. You aren't too harsh, each of your bullet points are valid and are exactly what I need to hear. "Don't try and make the game into something it's not, make it the best version of what it actually is." is true, I should try to follow the fun and focus on what works. Thanks again, seriously.