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Phantom of the Grove's itch.io pageJudge feedback
Judge feedback is anonymous.
- Reading through your GDD, it was very easy to see how everything worked together to create your game. I also appreciated that you included the breakdown of your team within! Your game itself was really fun! I enjoyed having to balance the difference between the different things you can do to fend off the loggers and making sure that I had enough energy to do so. Its an interesting take on the theme, weaponizing yourself by possessing others and making them turn on their friends. I will note it was hard to tell what I was aiming at and/or if I would hit anyone when I threw/swang the ax respectively. Otherwise it was fairly intuitive on how to navigate around and how well the trees were doing. However, while playing, I received a popup error with the key notes of "Maximum call stack size received at RangeError.ValueOf (<anonymous>)" at the start of day 6. I refreshed the page to see if it was a one-off and it happened again at the same time. A lot of the axes were left on the ground both times, so I was wondering if that might be a part of it. Overall, I loved the art style, and even with the awkwardness of not knowing the range of the axes, I enjoyed my time playing it!
Link to your Game Design Doc on Google Drive.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/17JzoJLv8A0BRY47NSzBKyTWiKFGqtGSU10kAlA3PHtE/edit?usp=sharing
Have you checked that your GDD is publicly accessible ?
Yes
Is your game set to public on itch.io so we can see it?
Yes
Summarise your game!
You are the vengeful spirit of an ancient woodland, tasked with defending the sacred Aya trees from relentless invaders.
How to play:
- Move: WASD and mouse.
- Ghost: Click to possess / Space to unpossess
- Invaders: Left mouse button fight / Right mouse button throw weapon
- Energy: Track energy in the top-right, recharge near trees and spend it on possession.
- Objective: Don’t lose the forest!
Please explain how your game fits the theme:
In the face of environmental catastrophe, you don’t just defend a forest: you are the forest. As the vengeful phantom of the grove, you strike fear into invaders by possessing enemies, triggering deadly traps, and twisting the environment against them. Every action you take is a direct extension of the forest’s wrath, making you not just a weapon but the ultimate force of nature.
Is there anything you'd like the judges to pay particular attention to?
All of the art is from scratch and made with love. While we have upcycled some of our past projects which never saw the light of day, we've spent heaps of time remoulding them into this game. With that said, we're currently focusing on developing our gameplay juice skills, so if you could provide any insights into how the game felt to play that would be greatly appreciated! E.g. how did you find the controls, was the game intuitive to play, was the difficulty ramp engaging, did you find strategic depth on any replays, etc.
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Comments
Incredible job with this game.
The possessing of the monsters to protect the trees was a lot of fun. I did encounter one instance where the possessed enemy got stuck in the grass and wouldn’t move, but other than that there were no issues.
The music was well done, it reminded me of something you’d hear in Hades.
Really neat art work as well. An all around great job!
Thanks Polliwog 😊 We love the music in Hades, might be a subconscious influence there 🤔
The art is great, and the music and sound effects bring the feel of the game out! The wait for nighttime to be over is nice, but a way to skip or fast-forward it would be nice.
I like the combat indicator, but it seems a little large, as I simply was running around spamming the attack button, dying then immediately re-possessing and doing the same thing. The attacks also seem a little slow, as if I was charging up an attack and the enemy wasn’t focused on me, they simply just ran past and easily avoided it.
The enemies move pretty quickly, and with multiple waves and the enemies splitting to hit multiple trees at once, it made the game a little hard, as you’re a lone defender. I noticed some of the enemies bugged outside the map (in the water) and just standing there.
My game crashed (or at least the browser froze) twice while playing the game. On the first time, my possession died and I immediately possessed another enemies that was hitting the tree. I noticed that the tree had a sad face which seemed like it had really low HP, and the enemy was in the middle of an attack. After the attack, the game just froze, but the music kept playing for a little while. Second time round something similar happened, where I was spamming possession and throwing their weapons before running out of energy and having the browser freeze up again.
The difficulty seemed to ramp up pretty quickly, as the first 2 days seemed pretty easy, until the enemies increased a lot, with different weapons and having multiple groups. I’m not sure if this was intended, but when possessing an enemy, attacking, then immediately unpossessing and possessing another enemy, the enemies seem to immediately attack me despite me not hitting them yet.
While I don’t mind the WASD to move the camera, with the mouse hover controlling the spirit, I feel that hovering at the edge of the screen (or close to the edge) should also pan the camera toward that direction. This way it is possible to play the game purely using mouse alone.
It also seems possible for you to permanently keep an enemy throughout the night, by simply keeping them a short distance from the tree, unpossessing to regenerate energy, then possessing them again before they hit the tree. I used the same enemy in Day 1 to clear up to Day 3 before he finally got hit. Not sure if this was intended or not.
The art and music are great for a short prototype, the gameplay seems like it needs a little tweaks to make it feel better. Not sure if there is an end to the game, but perhaps a way to defeat all enemies and win before moving to another forest might be a good addition. Great job for the game jam!
Ah breadpan, you're awesome 🙌
You're making peoples' days doing the write-ups you're doing. Seriously kind stuff.
I've itemised each of your feedback bits and pieces and we'll be working through them systematically to get the gameplay feeling as delicious and crunchy as possible (like a good 🍞).
If I may ask for one more comment - we're building out this prototype into a full game with a campaign, storyline, endless wave mode, more enemy types (torches that start fires, wards that block possession, that kinda thing) - oh and a perk tree for a roguelite vibe. The vision is to "Orcs Must Die" it, if you get my meaning 😅 Could you see yourself paying 20 bucks for something like that? If no, what features would need to be in the game to get you over the line (or what price point)? If yes, what would you be hoping the game delivers on?
Thanks again!
Thank you for the kind words!
I’ll take it as 20 USD is the price. First and foremost, I have never played Orcs must die so I don’t really get the vision, so my opinion will mainly be generally based off other games.
For the current game as it is, the first issue that has to be fixed is the crashes, as that is what stops your game from being played the most.
The most important thing, especially in a paid game is gameplay and content. The gameplay currently seems fine, and as you are adding more enemy types, a storyline, perk trees etc., I don’t really see that as too much of a problem.
But the content seems severely lacking. If you look at other games, for example, one of your inspirations, Ori and the Blind Forest is $19.99 (technically same price as yours) but has close to 10 hours of gameplay content. Some other examples are, Hollow Knight at $14.99 with over 20 hours of gameplay, Hades at $24.99 with over 20 hours of gameplay, Risk of Rain 2 at $24.99 with around 7-8 hours of gameplay, but very replayable.
Most of those games are hours in length, and despite Risk of Rain 2 there being the shortest game, I actually spent the most hours on that due to the replayability. If your game’s pricing point is competing with games like those, it has to have hours of gameplay minimally. The gameplay should also not be fillers, and say, expanding from 10 days of enemy waves to 100 days of enemy waves just to extend playtime, but new areas and mechanics that the players can enjoy.
If you feel the game can’t be as in-depth as those games, I feel it’s better to lower the price, or to spend way more time adding depth to the game. Game Jam games are usually best being really short, so the current game should only be a very small fraction of the full game based on your scope, think in the sense of half of Forgotten Crossroads being Hollow Knight’s prototype.
Ah yeah you're very right, content is key for sure.
Orcs Must Die is a tower-defense / shoot-em-up hybrid, familiar to this (which we realised after we made the game). They encourage replayability quite brilliantly by allowing the player to go through the maps in campaign mode, then play again on harder difficulties, or try an endless mode. There's also a co-op mode, and leaderboards for each mode / difficulty shared with friends, plus global highscores. Then there's a perk tree system that allows you to gradually unlock more skills & traps as you earn more stars for doing well in the levels.
We're also contemplating introducing a light touch of roguelite elements to randomise powerups in the level - something like a "choose a bonus from these options" kinda thing each night, to encourage the player to try different playstyles (e.g. you could play aggressively and focus on possession, play strategically and lay more traps, or focus more on stealth and try to thwart their plans without getting caught). But this definitely requires finetuning.
There's also a reasonably low-hanging fruit of local multiplayer. But on Steam that mightn't count for much (more on console). Online MP is out of scope for the first release, I'd say.
But, assuming we created ~10-15 hours of replayable content, it sounds like you're saying Phantom of the Grove's gameplay is interesting enough and the premise is captivating enough that, sans the bugs, you'd give it a try for $20 USD?
Personally, likely not. As my usual games are mainly survival games, like Subnautica, Ark Survival, The Forest or MMOs like FFXIV Online, so I’m likely not your target audience.
But, I do say that the gameplay is something that players would pay for, it currently is quite simple, but has many ways to expand on like you mentioned a perk tree, campaign more, more enemy types etc. If you are able to put out something interesting that can be played for 10-15 hours, your main concern should be marketing and letting your game be known. Be it reducing the price, so more players get to try it, or releasing a demo of the first few levels, the main priority should be getting your game’s name out there, unless you’re creating something so unique and amazing that players will advertise it themselves.
That's great feedback, thank you so much for your time! Reach out to us if you'd ever like feedback on one of your games. I'm always happy to record myself playing and give live commentary - I find the best way to truly see the heatmap of friction for new players is to watch them play through it.
Awesome art! I liked the mechanic of taking control of the monsters. The action was a little slow to start, and the combat needs another mechanic or two to juice it up a bit. But overall looks like you have a great foundation here! Really good job!
Thanks grantlerr, really appreciate the kind words, and we agree - the action could use a more juicy ramp. We're building an improved version on Steam that features multiple levels, each with a unique mechanic to tease & explore. I'll send you a link once it's ready if you're interested?
This is very well done. I like the twist on tower defense. I don't have a lot to say beyond what has been said in other comments. I got to Day 6 and my browser threw up an error and the game froze, so I didn't get very far. Regarding the gameplay juice feedback you asked for:
- I like how impactful the combat feels. I'm not a fan of the circular area of effect that the attack has. I didn't feel like there was any major skill to combat; I just ran to proximity of enemies and spammed attack without regard for positioning.
- I'd have liked a bit more enemy variety. In the 6 days I played, I only ever saw that one chipmunk looking guy. I don't know how long the game is, but having a new enemy type thrown in on day 2 or 3 might make things a bit more interesting.
Amazing job on the graphics by the way. It's really a beautiful game. I found myself just flitting around the swamp admiring how everything looks.
Hey, thanks so much for the detailed feedback! We are building an improved version without the bugs plus all the great feedback yourself and others have shared. I'll link the Steam page once it's up if you're interested!
Great game! I really like the possession twist on tower defense. I did notice some cases where enemies are sort of stuck on the map. Not sure if those are previously possessed guys I neglected to drown / blow up or what, but it stuck out because I wasted some time trying to kill them while actual enemies were attacking a tree.
Great potential here and you're already pretty far along the way! Thumbs up!
Thanks! Yeah there are a few ghost drogs we need to sort out in the next version :)
Wow, what a fantastic game! My favourite game in this jam so far :)
Totally loved the art and the sound work, and the controls are rather smooth! When I accidentally drowned the enemy, it was also a very interesting surprise :)
The only minor issue - I didn't quite get the point of the night, since not much happened, but I guess I can heal/replenish there?
Great submission!
Aw thanks Rakudajin that's really kind of you to say.
Hm yeah, we introduced night as a reprieve for the player early on, to break up the chaos. Then later we introduce Drogs with torch helmets to start breaking that reprieve. Originally we thought we'd add more of a trap-setting mechanic where you could add more traps at night, but it turned out we enjoyed the possession mechanic so much that we focused all our time on that part instead.
Thanks for playing!
love the art direction! and the concept! great job!
Thank you! 😊
It's an excellent game with a great concept, and playing as the spear-man is truly satisfying.
Yeah the spear Drogs are our favourite too 😄 thanks for playing!
Very cool idea! Love the art style and mechanics. You guys should be proud!
Aw thanks Naizy 😊 your game is awesome too!
I liked the art style, the mechanics, I enjoyed playing it, good work!!!
Thank you!
Very cool art style and the possession mechanic. The player and camera movement is a little confusing at the start. For the future games consider setting up camera to follow the player and adding slight offset at the mouse direction. Good work!
Ah awesome, thanks for the feedback!
I really like this idea! There are a few problems however. The art is amazing, however the initial impressions leave a lot to be desired. It would be better to start on a smaller map in order to give the player more time to get accustomed to the mechanics. Additionally, the way the enemies spawn encourage camping as well. The fact that enemies have different weapons that you can use against them is really damn awesome. However, I would simplify the energy system and communicate the ways it drains / grows. Solid game!
Thanks Vickyboi! Yep totally agree about it being ideal to have multiple stages. Unfortunately the time crunch has made this more a prototype than anything, but in the future I think it would be cool to have "worlds" that you slowly unlock by accessing more and more trees. Good note about the camping and energy communication. Thanks a lot!
I'm sorry, I can barely play this game. The controls are overly precise on a larger screen, there's no in-game way to see the control scheme, and one button is mapped to two actions. The concept is neat, the gameplay is not.
Hey Feli, thanks for the feedback! May I ask, when you say "larger screen" are you on an ultra-wide? 🤔 Or 1920 x 1080? We definitely need to add an in-game way to view the controls (unfortunately that's been last on the list). Thanks for letting us know about the control issues, we'll try a few things to improve it!
My laptop is indeed 1920x1080, I wasn't trying to play in full-screen though. I just couldn't get clicking to be very precise in the end. It did run smoothly though.
Oh right, yeah the game needs to be played in fullscreen. I'll put that in the description, thanks!
The idea and execution are really well done! I didn’t figure out the energy issue before most of my trees were destroyed, however the forest is now safe forever as the AI cannot successfully path find to the large tree. The all drown in front of the tree, and I am now on day 14 without having done anything. Enemies stopped spawning eventually.
My only criticism is that the days are too short. When you possess an enemy, you only get a few attacks before the day has ended. This makes it near impossible to clear the entire forest quite quickly.
Thanks DragonMoffon, this is great feedback - really useful. We've fixed the bug where they drown in front of the tree and increased the length of the days by double. I have a feeling you'll have a hard time getting to Day 10 now >:)
Once I figured out that you have to stand next to the trees to recharge energy, I got really into it. Can't get past Day 8 though, it's too crazy...
Nice interpretation of the theme. It's probably one of the more unique ones I've seen so far, nice work :)
Thanks! It's a subject that's dear to our hearts :)
Hordes of goblins are close to my heart too :')